Should there be a standard Diagnostic charge

[Gonzo]

I don't want to sound like a repeat of most of my other posts. But, free isn't free... if you want to break up the diagnostics into different levels... fine. But when I have a tech that comes up to me and says, "I've done 12 free code checks today.... what's my pay for all of that..." Now talk to me about free.... it ain't folks...

I've had those days where that's all I've done... read codes, or read codes a diagnose... and never made the repairs... either do to time or dollars.

 

The next time I go to the doctor or dentist... I'm going to ask him what I would get for a no charge visit... I'm probably going to get laughed out of the office... but I'm going to do it just the same.

 

Those free clinics that are out there for those who can't afford any other means of medical care are needed... because not all can afford good quality svc... But, that doesn't mean I have to drop my standards to meet those needs... I've got a family to support...

If I had a "free clinic" for car diagnostics and code reading... I'm sure it would be just like the free clinic... where a un-named weathly person or organization was sponsoring the "free clinic" to the public... and the doctors were either donating their time or doing it for a reduced fee.

 

Like I said ... nothing is free... so stop trying to do it with my livelyhood....

 

We all have seen this in some form or fashion.

 

Reading the codes--Free

Diagnosing the problem--$50

Fixing it right the first time---priceless.

[Gonzo]

Yesterday I got a call, this guy was lost... he was only a couple of blocks away and had a hard time understanding directions. I'd say east and he would say west... anyway, he did make it to the shop.

He comes up to the counter and introduces himself as "Doctor... so and so" his dash lights were out on his car... I told him I was caught up with things and could get to it in about 20 minutes or so.

I told him our diagnostic charge ... this guy just stood there... "you're going to charge me to look at it"

I told him, "ain't that what you do?"

then he started making excuses as to what time of the day it was and that he would have to bring it back on Tuesday... yea right... I'll save ya a spot Mr. Doctor... ya'd think a doctor of all people wouldn't have a problem understanding the basics of a diagnostic procedure...

I'm no doctor... but.... you know the rest.

 

 

I don't want to sound like a repeat of most of my other posts. But, free isn't free... if you want to break up the diagnostics into different levels... fine. But when I have a tech that comes up to me and says, "I've done 12 free code checks today.... what's my pay for all of that..." Now talk to me about free.... it ain't folks...

I've had those days where that's all I've done... read codes, or read codes a diagnose... and never made the repairs... either do to time or dollars.

 

The next time I go to the doctor or dentist... I'm going to ask him what I would get for a no charge visit... I'm probably going to get laughed out of the office... but I'm going to do it just the same.

 

Those free clinics that are out there for those who can't afford any other means of medical care are needed... because not all can afford good quality svc... But, that doesn't mean I have to drop my standards to meet those needs... I've got a family to support...

If I had a "free clinic" for car diagnostics and code reading... I'm sure it would be just like the free clinic... where a un-named weathly person or organization was sponsoring the "free clinic" to the public... and the doctors were either donating their time or doing it for a reduced fee.

 

Like I said ... nothing is free... so stop trying to do it with my livelyhood....

 

 

[xrac]

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[Gonzo]

He wasn't Indian or Pakistanis.... just a cheap -o-

and yes... MY dash lights work...LOL

I wonder if when the dentist goes to a doctor do they discuss rates before doing any tests??

 

All I can say Gonzo is that your dash lights work when you drive home. Was this guy an Indian and Pakistanis doctor? No to sound prejudiced but they are real bad about not wanting to pay for stuff. It muts be a cultural thing.

[Joe Marconi]

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[gravysuckinpig]

There is ASE, MAPS, BBB and many other organizations that shops can belong to , all designed to ensure , or reassure the public that this shop has qualifications,training, and integrity. Any one ever hear of an organization devoted to "billing practices"? would it be beyond the scope and powers of this forum to get together and create a NEW organization, one that could get other shops to join, one that could advertise for other shops to become members of - the more shops that join across the u.s. the better organized and more "consistent" prices would be from shop to shop - the less and less customers would expect Free, just because so and so up the street does it. well....so and so isnt a member of "XXX", what is "xxx" you ask? Its an organization that promotes fair billing practices for services rendered in the auto repair industry, all shops belonging to "xxx" have the experience, equipment and training to be able to charge appropriately and fairly for those services. not marketed as a license to "charge"... but to "ensure charges are fair and customary"

Who would argue with the policy of an organization whose goal was, to be sure that customers were not "overcharged" for services? If this organization determined a $65 diag fee was reasonable - who would argue that? after all - they are looking out for my best interest.. but as i said - it could not be marketed as i license to "charge" -it would need to a watchdog against "overcharging"

 

any thoughts? spins?

[Dr.Dave]

I think most of us agree we deserve to charge for what we do and diag requires expensive equiptment and trained personal.Now I,d like to hear more about how the succesful shops are selling it.The last post I saw about giving the initail scan away in order to win the customer over is a good thought. But I,d like to see amore modified version where I,d charge alittle or give a rebate for work performed.I don't know about your area but where I am people for some reason( ADVANCE AUTO)think they can fix a check engine light them selves armed with the code. The economy is bad peolpe around here don,t care if the ck engine light is on until they have ti go through emmission testing.The problem it they need to know whats its going to cost to fix. So I thought for a small fee I could be able to scan and get a rough est on what it may cost but I need help with a sles pitch

[xrac]

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[FROGFINDER]

There should be a fee to spend effort and time to trace a problem. All we have to sell is time and the clock is ticking.

[Joe Marconi]

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[Jeff]

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[xrac]

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[Gonzo]

Ya can't fix stupid..... My old saying, "Stupid is free, Brains will cost you some bucks... that's why you pay to go to college..."

I had a guy who came in yesterday with a Chevy truck with high idle. He told me he had paid some guy $200 to fix it but it was still idling the same and he had been told we could tell him what was wrong with it. He was probably sent to us by the Zone. We get quite a few of them from there but I think he though we did "free diagnosis". Evidentlly he wanted us to tell him what was wrong with it so he could go back to the guy who hadn't fixed it. Evidently he though we would do that for nothing. He was all gung hoe on us looking at it until I told him that our base diagnosis was $46.80. He than began to talk about when he would have time for us to look at it and he would get back to us. My thoughts are he has already spent $200, he may damage additional parts driving it with the running problem he has, he is burning a lot of gas that ain't cheap, and he is probably carboning a lot of stuff up but he doesn't see the value of paying someone who knows what they are doing to tell him what is really wrong. To my way of thinking thsat is DUMB. I just laughed to myself when he left and thought that my car will run great on the way home tonight.

[Gonzo]

Computers can never replace humans. They may become capable of artificial intelligence, but they will never master real stupidity.

 

 

Ya can't fix stupid..... My old saying, "Stupid is free, Brains will cost you some bucks... that's why you pay to go to college..."

 

[gravysuckinpig]

I had a guy who came in yesterday with a Chevy truck with high idle. He told me he had paid some guy $200 to fix it but it was still idling the same and he had been told we could tell him what was wrong with it. He was probably sent to us by the Zone. We get quite a few of them from there but I think he though we did "free diagnosis". Evidentlly he wanted us to tell him what was wrong with it so he could go back to the guy who hadn't fixed it. Evidently he though we would do that for nothing. He was all gung hoe on us looking at it until I told him that our base diagnosis was $46.80. He than began to talk about when he would have time for us to look at it and he would get back to us. My thoughts are he has already spent $200, he may damage additional parts driving it with the running problem he has, he is burning a lot of gas that ain't cheap, and he is probably carboning a lot of stuff up but he doesn't see the value of paying someone who knows what they are doing to tell him what is really wrong. To my way of thinking thsat is DUMB. I just laughed to myself when he left and thought that my car will run great on the way home tonight.

Most of the people who come to you for a diagnosis after they "paid someone to fix it"- tried to fix it themselves, and don't want to admit they screwed up - otherwise for $200 they would be back at the guys "shop" wanting it fixed, or a refund. IF they even bothered to pull out of the lot with it. what i love is the "regular mechanic" - i just wanna know what is wrong with it so i can tell my regular mechanic - if i took my car to my "regular mechanic" and he couldnt figure out what was wrong with it then i think i would find another "regular mechanic".

[Jeff]

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[OTPAuto]

As a fairly new shop (almost 2 years open) that isn't trying to be a bottom feeder, we charge a flat $100 diag fee (assuming it's not something thats going to take half a day or more, like ripping the interior out of a car to find a short or a water leak etc - then the customer gets a phone call explaining that we need more diag time, or we put the car back together and they pick it up.), with the caveat that if we do the repairs, then we waive the diag fee. The entire purpose, in my mind, is to avoid diagnosing cars for people that have no intentions in having us repair the vehicle. I don't want to diag cars for other people to fix, even if we get paid the diag time only. I want to fix cars. And being a small 2-bay shop, people wasting our time is infinitely more valuable than a bit of diag.

Edited April 9, 2017 by OTPAuto

[jfuhrmad]

Here's a trick we learned.  Stop using the word "diagnostic".  For some reason people match that up with computers and think you can just plug a computer in and it will show you what is wrong.  We use the word inspection.  For example, A/C Inspection, Brake Inspection, Runability Inspection etc...  Then we quickly describe all the things we inspect during that inspection, we tell them what the inspection costs and ask if they want to do it.  We have no problem billing 100% of our time.  And yes, never mention time.  Just make sure your inspection prices match up to the actual time by checking every now and then.  Works great and nobody bucks us at all.

[Custom Coach]

Our shop is a very small one body and paint man (my brother) and one mechanic (me).

I charge for the initial scan and I do my best to get across to the customer just what it is that my equipment does that the cheap scanners at AutoZone, advance auto and Oreilly auto don't look for or cannot see as a generic scanner.

I had one customer who stopped in and had several hundred dollars worth of parts with them from the free read auto parts store.

They wanted me to change everything they had bought, I could have been greedy and taken their money but instead I said let me scan it and see what we are dealing with for certain.

Instead of them spending a large amount of money to fix the problem they spent 200.00 to fix the problem and took back the parts that were not required to fix the problem.

my scanner is wireless so I can let my customers watch the process I go through and they can see first hand that I can usually narrow down the trouble through the testing process.  this way its better than just saying well it might be this lets throw a b & c at it and see what sticks.

[HemiHondo]

Bottom Line;

Free Estimates If you tell us what parts you want to replaced.

Otherwise we must charge you for our time in locating your autos' troubles.

 

 

[cdhowell]

OK, it seems most agree that diagnostics should be charged. I am curious as to how most of you are charging. Just by time or by test. In the past I have only charged by time up to 2 hrs. Unless it's intermittent or requires a lot of tear down to do the test. I have been thinking a lot about menu board pricing. $X Smoke test. $X Fuel pressure test. $x Coolant pressure test. The dreaded P0300 could get spendy for the customer. Thoughts 

[HemiHondo]

 Because no parts are sold during fault tracing,profit suffers.We have 2 labor rates;1 Diagnostic labor rate-2 Standard labor rate.....Our diag rate is 30% more than the standard rate.In most cases,we begin with quoting for 1 Hour of diag & move forward from there & have been for several years.

[xrac]

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[skm]

There are a few things that I think need to be kept in mind.. one I always charge a diagnostic fee on electrical/check engine lights of 100 bucks.. The customer is made aware if it is an electrical problem ie short or something the diagnostic will still be 100 bucks but a repair cost will include looking for the short.. Also we have our reputation to keep in mind, so anyone that comes to me with parts in hand or codes that some parts store, their neighbor, or they have pulled I tell them I will not put the parts on or go off of what they give me .. i will do my own diagnostics and repair the car properly since my reputation is on the line and I am good at what I do and I want my reputation to stay the way it is.. Also customers when they come with their own parts you lose money from the get go both with diagnostics and with the part. Also when you let a customer bring their own parts they will always want to bring their own parts, and when you give in and give a customer a deal every time that customer comes in you are going to be in a battle over a deal again. So nip it in the bud just don't do it.. It seems the ones you help out and give a deal are the one's that are the biggest pain in the butt.. Let them go they are not making you money in fact are making you lose money with parts and the time spent arguing with them over cost and diagnostics . Last, it is your business not the customer's business . We do not live in a country where we barter for things we are a capitalist country . When was the last time you saw someone at the grocery store making a deal over the price of their groceries or go behind the deli counter and fill their own bags of meat and cheese and ask for a discount since they helped themselves? never happens so why let it happen you your business?

[autoguy]

On 8/22/2017 at 8:53 PM, cdhowell said:

OK, it seems most agree that diagnostics should be charged. I am curious as to how most of you are charging. Just by time or by test. In the past I have only charged by time up to 2 hrs. Unless it's intermittent or requires a lot of tear down to do the test. I have been thinking a lot about menu board pricing. $X Smoke test. $X Fuel pressure test. $x Coolant pressure test. The dreaded P0300 could get spendy for the customer. Thoughts 

Yes diagnostic time is a must. It costs money to have equipment, scan tools and updates to those scan tools and software. Customer don't always understand that.

[skm]

HAha, this thread will continue on and on..  Easy said 110% a diagnostic charge needs to be charged, the diagnostics is the hard part of the job a set price to start is how we do it. Customers are told there is a set charge and it will be adjusted depending on what is found more added if more time is needed and some taken off if it is a simple easy find such as something left unplugged etc.  If you have to question it next time you go to the doctor ask him or her if you can just pay for the medication given and not the x  rays, bloodwork,  ct scan or any other tests done, see the answer you get .

[xrac]

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[skm]

1 hour ago, xrac said:

Shade tree mechanics and the Autozones of the world have made this difficult.  Technology has outstripped the public's knowledge and created a gap between what they think we do and what actually has to be done  

 

Well said Frank! " but can't you just plug that thing in under the dash that tells you what is wrong?"

[Gonzo]

Well said Frank! " but can't you just plug that thing in under the dash that tells you what is wrong?"

Well, that's all ya gotta do to fix it anyway...

Sent from my SM-J727V using Tapatalk

[xrac]

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[skm]

2 hours ago, xrac said:

Everybody knows that. Autozone has done diagnosed it for me.  

don't forget they even give you the "buy and try" list for free !

[jeffa1958]

ESTIMATES ARE FREE. DIAGNOSIS COSTS MONEY. 

[bantar]

Aside from many of the Indians and random others not wanting to pay for diagnostics, I've seen quite a different and interesting reaction from the young very-pretty girls.  "What do you mean I have to pay?"   They have such a confused look on their face before they leave. 

[Custom Coach]

This is a touchy subject.

Most people believe that the GODS of the automotive stores have all the answers in THEIR scans and trying to convince most customers its a generic scanner and their could be more to it than what their scan shows

This sometimes is like pulling teeth for the fact that they saw it on TV so it has to be true.

I had a gentleman a couple years back brought me his car and over $500.00 in parts that the local AutoZone sold him because that's what was affiliated with his codes.

I told him lets hook up mine and see what it really said.

turned out his whole problem was a chewed wire leading to the MAF sensor grounding out to the block once in a while

However with all these aftermarket gizmos you just plug in and you get a code on your smart phone because WE ARE ALL CROOKS according to the commercials its getting harder and harder to convince the younger drivers that our scanners and we ourselves just might know more than these cheap scanners.

my favorite commercial around here show a couple in the middle of nowhere and the check engine light come on and he pulls over to stare under the hood BUT the next time with their new code scanner it sends a message to her phone telling her its a faulty sensor and she just tells him that and then says were good!

well it all depends on which sensor it is if your good or not or you might be walking in the next 5 miles

got to love infomercials  (NOT)

[Bockman's Auto Care]

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[xrac]

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[jeffa1958]

Since the dawn of time there have been people that are NOT my customers. There will continue to always be people that are not my customers. Concentrate on the ones that are. Not all of them are stupid with no basis for reality. 

[Custom Coach]

12 hours ago, jeffa1958 said:

Since the dawn of time there have been people that are NOT my customers. There will continue to always be people that are not my customers. Concentrate on the ones that are. Not all of them are stupid with no basis for reality. 

yes there are people who are not my customers either.

BUT people walk into my shop everyday some turn out to be customers and some you just can not get through to no matter what analogy you use.

I do however try to inform people about their vehicle and their troubles so they don't get the idea all mechanics are crooks and just out to take advantage of them

like some of these commercials try to lead people to believe.

I still believe their should be a one size fits all initial scan charge because dealers around here charge $100.00 and up to do an initial scan and a lot of people cant afford that

So I charge $50.00 and that makes the customer happy because they are saving money and it more than covers my scanner updates every year and any trade in / upgrades it might need

[mastertechlex]

We always start with the "quick" FREE check. This allows us to qualify the customer and gives our techs time to determine the next course of action. We then we sell diag testing based upon the tests the tech suggests we need to perform.