The "Gravy" Tech

[bsb1264]

I'm only 29, but I did start my automotive career at 16. Advancement and knowing the latest training has always been my number one goal. I am now the lead tech at my shop. Then you have the gravy tech, which seems to be filling the bays up more and more. The guys that don't care about training, don't care about the warranty job, and always seem to avoid the "challenging" repairs. You can't fire them because it's to busy OR you can't find the next quality technician to make your team more successful which seems to be more harder to find.

 

For management it's great, here is a guy we can pay 10.00 per hour, that does nothing but flushes, alignments and brake jobs, and makes the shop profit. For us technicians, it's being stuck with the nightmare electrical problems and diagnostic problems, trying to scrape up every possible hour to make ends meat.

 

I'm not really directing this to the younger guys that are just starting out in there career, but the guys that have been doing this longer than me, or even longer.

 

How do you guys handle these kinds of employees, to me it just seems like they will never change and always get away with the way they work.

[Spence]

Are you a tech/owner or just a tech?

[phynny]

Do you get paid the same as the "gravy tech"?

[Jmazur]

This is a tough topic, and one that i dealt with when i was a tech, and also now as a shop owner. Having someone doing nothing but easy work when you are doing all of the tough stuff is not fun. This happened to me very often when i was a tech. But dont fall into the trap of comparing yourself to the work others are getting. Those "gravy techs" should be paid much less than you are, and if you are the lead tech, your owner should be taking pretty good care of you. You should be making a good income if your skills are where you say they are. The diagnostic work you do, and the repairs that go with it, are necessary to shop operations and add to your value as a tech. Anyone can bolt on parts and some of them can even do it right. But few can do high level diagnostics. You are obviously unhappy with the situation in your current shop, as evidenced by the fact that you made this post. I would suggest that you sit down with your owner or manager, and talk about the issues you have, and give them a chance to fix them. I am not talking about making demands, but talking together about finding solutions that benefit you and the company you work for. And if you cant find good solutions together, look for somewhere that will. There are plenty of shops that would love to have a strong "A" tech who cares about the quality of work put out by the whole shop.

[Joe Marconi]

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[ADealerTech]

As a fellow tech, the real problem that I see in the trenches, is that diag is too often given away by the advisors and service managers. Then when they give it away, they expect you to eat that time too. They seem to think that you shouldn't get paid, because they didn't get paid for their decisions. The resolution to this is for shops to stop catering to the idea that time is free just because a repair hasn't been performed yet. The customer needs to be told (explained to) that the repair process starts at the identification of the problem step and not at the installation of the replacement part. Time is money and as techs we should be paid not only for what we can do, but what we know. It is up to the management to figure out if the 2 hours the tech took was because he was unfamiliar and another tech would have done it in 1 or if that was a legit 2 hours, but they need to stop even taking in complex issues without pointing out that the customer will be responsible to pay for the diag time. Obviously we cannot expect 0.3 for every low tire light that comes in and we put air in it, but that CEL scan should only be free when the only thing the customer is getting out of it is a print out with a code. The only thing I would give for free is an educated guess with a disclaimer.

Unfortunately, this is an idealistic situation, a shop can start doing this tomorrow, and somewhere in the city some Craigslist "tech" or other start-up/franchise shop will run a free diag gimmick and the customer will walk out the door the moment they are told diag is sold in 0.5 blocks. I do not see any realistic way to re-train the customer and rid the world of people who will work for free in a hope they make 0.3 on a quick part swap after the diag. Am I cynical? Maybe. I would love to know of any other realistic outcome though.

 

The way my current dealer handles this is through teams. We are open Monday-Saturday 7:30 AM to 9 PM. We have 2 5 guy tech teams, one works Monday-Wednesday 7:30 AM to 9 PM (roughly 39.5 hours a week) and the other covers the same hours Thursday-Saturday. They rotate every 5 weeks, which is another benefit, but that is another post. This way the A guy gets the same hours as the guy doing gravy. They are all in the shop for the same amount of hours, they all get paid the same amount of hours. It has it's downfalls, especially if a slacker gets on board, but when running well oiled, the guy chasing an intermittent CAN failure isn't begrudging the guy doing a Service E and 4 wheel brake job, he is instead, encouraging that guy to pile on as many hours as possible to make up for the lack of output (not work) of hours he is doing. They never earn less than 40, even on slow weeks.

[Steve Smith]

The shop owners, managers, dealerships and repair chains are all getting rich off the hard work and tools of the low level to high level mechanics and technicians.

[Steve Smith]

I have worked in gas stations, dealerships, small shops, large shops, had my own shop and worked for a major manufacture research and engineering department. Master ASE, smog license for 30 years. The mistreatment, disrespect, and under valuation on almost all levels of mechanic and technician occupations and jobs will never change unless we UNIONIZE AND FORCE THE GREEDY business owners to pay a fair a decent wage and benefits. If that forces some shops to close good riddance. If a lot of low level mechanics, hacks, gravy grabbers and money whores lose their jobs...good riddance.

[phynny]

Hey Steve, go take your garbage and cry to someone that cares. It's obvious that you have failed in the game of life looking at all the jobs you couldn't succeed at. I always find it funny when someone fails at a business and then has the nerve to tell the world how they should run one lol.

 

 

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[lmcca]

The shop owners, managers, dealerships and repair chains are all getting rich off the hard work and tools of the low level to high level mechanics and technicians.

 

bringing up the dead eh? this post was made in 2013.....

[stowintegrity]

This is the first time I've ever heard anyone actually compain about this specifically, and I'm really glad to hear the input. To continue with the same verbage, we have a couple of "Gravy Techs" at our shop, too, but I haven't heard my other, more experienced staff complain much about it. I've seen what it's like for some of them to be tied up with, or "married" to a job...or wrestling with a job, because it's a more involved one, or one that requires more patience, skill, equipment, or experience.

 

The pattern I'm hearing, though, is that someone in that more skilled position is unhappy because they don't feel like they're getting paid enough. Whether their rate isn't wht it should be for what they bring to the table, or they're expected to do work that they're not getting paid the time on. Either way, this doesn't seem like a real complaint or problem that should be directed at a "lesser" experienced employee. I agree with Joe - take your concerns to the guy thats writing your paycheck, and discuss them with him or her in a frank, but professional way. I'm a firm believer in letting your value speak for itself, but sometimes it's ok to remind the boss if things start to seem a little lop-sided. (He DOES have a lot on his plate, too, right?)

 

I'm not afraid to admit that if I knew I could fill each of my bays with a dozen fluid flushes & nothing but the simplest, high-dollar, easy in & out brake jobs & tune-ups....well...I think I'd definitely restructure the bench strength of my staff, and pay a competitive "B" rate that was suitable for that kind of work. If I was doing a million dollars a year in just those kinds of services, I might just start turning away the more complicated stuff.

 

Let's face it, though - that's not the nature of our business. I didn't put up a building and say, "This is where I'm gonna be the brake service king of the city".

We opened our doors and vowed that we were going to maintain a focus on our customers and their needs so ferocious, that the resulting loyalty would be something that NONE of our competitors could ever touch, or begin to try to take away from us. We saw that building and said, "This is where I'm going to work everyday, and serve the needs of as many people as I can, professionally."

 

There's lots of parts on a car. Some of them, even I can replace. But it takes a staff of profesisonals, all with carying levels of skill, in order to even come CLOSE to being that 1-Stop shop everyone dreams about.

 

Just one man at the helm of a wonderful adventure.

[Handson]

Unionize and force the greedy business owners. Am I the only business owner making less then my lead tech?

[Steve Smith]

Hey Steve, go take your garbage and cry to someone that cares. It's obvious that you have failed in the game of life looking at all the jobs you couldn't succeed at. I always find it funny when someone fails at a business and then has the nerve to tell the world how they should run one lol.

 

 

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typical ignorant "attack" the truth response from some random a hole greedy shop owner. no fail here chump ricer. take the blue pill punk.

[SMMotors]

I have worked in gas stations, dealerships, small shops, large shops, had my own shop and worked for a major manufacture research and engineering department. Master ASE, smog license for 30 years. The mistreatment, disrespect, and under valuation on almost all levels of mechanic and technician occupations and jobs will never change unless we UNIONIZE AND FORCE THE GREEDY business owners to pay a fair a decent wage and benefits. If that forces some shops to close good riddance. If a lot of low level mechanics, hacks, gravy grabbers and money whores lose their jobs...good riddance.

 

I have actually worked in a unionized auto repair shop. I was in IAMAW LOCAL 1484 for 7 years. Great benefits, crap pay, and had to do what the masters told me. Wanted to go to work but the metal workers are striking? Too bad, you ain't going to work because we have to stand with " our brother". Didn't matter that i didn't have a dog in the fight, had a wife and 2 kids to feed, it's the union way!

 

Unions have done wonders for the economy wouldn't you say? No budget deficits to be seen anywhere, especially in California, Chicago, Greece, ......

 

The only reason I was able to work in a union shop that survived was because it was commercial fleet. We worked at the docks and refinery and had contracts.

 

Contract comes up? No more worky for me. Not many non multi billion dollars companies that can support union auto workers.

 

In private industry, it would never work. The labor rate would have to be double to support the mandated benefits and payacsle the unions demand. There goes free industry. We now all have to charge the same to make it work. So much for a free America.

 

Your argument is counterintuitive. It doesn't work. The problem is the public image, auto zone advertising that " any one can fix a car, we will scan it for free and tell you what to replace", and trying to be the cheapest around. That's an amazing marketing campaign autozone has by the way. Sell more parts and never have to figure out the problem. I digress.

 

I do find it interesting that after 30 years and being a master tech that you've never found a place that appreciates you. I can't imagine why. I would hire an ASE Master with smog in a heartbeat and I pay well. And yes, I'm one of the "greedy bastards" that you're referring to. Funny thing though, I've had the same employees for 13 years. I charge more than the dealers and yet my lot is full and my next opening isn't till next week.

 

So we have taken the union option off the table, you've been a shop owner ( that didn't work however you can understand the troubles that small business ownerships have) and you've been in the business for 30 years. What is another option?

 

I don't give away diag time and I also don't pay flat rate. I feel that shops that don't charge for inspections and testing are hurting our image and are part of the problem.

 

 

PS, I have taken a blue pill, it's a great time !

[SMMotors]

I have worked in gas stations, dealerships, small shops, large shops, had my own shop and worked for a major manufacture research and engineering department. Master ASE, smog license for 30 years. The mistreatment, disrespect, and under valuation on almost all levels of mechanic and technician occupations and jobs will never change unless we UNIONIZE AND FORCE THE GREEDY business owners to pay a fair a decent wage and benefits. If that forces some shops to close good riddance. If a lot of low level mechanics, hacks, gravy grabbers and money whores lose their jobs...good riddance.

 

I have actually worked in a unionized auto repair shop. I was in IAMAW LOCAL 1484 for 7 years. Great benefits, crap pay, and had to do what the masters told me. Wanted to go to work but the metal workers are striking? Too bad, you ain't going to work because we have to stand with " our brother". Didn't matter that i didn't have a dog in the fight, had a wife and 2 kids to feed, it's the union way!

 

Unions have done wonders for the economy wouldn't you say? No budget deficits to be seen anywhere, especially in California, Chicago, Greece, ......

 

The only reason I was able to work in a union shop that survived was because it was commercial fleet. We worked at the docks and refinery and had contracts.

 

Contract comes up? No more worky for me. Not many non multi billion dollars companies that can support union auto workers.

 

In private industry, it would never work. The labor rate would have to be double to support the mandated benefits and payacsle the unions demand. There goes free industry. We now all have to charge the same to make it work. So much for a free America.

 

Your argument is counterintuitive. It doesn't work. The problem is the public image, auto zone advertising that " any one can fix a car, we will scan it for free and tell you what to replace", and trying to be the cheapest around. That's an amazing marketing campaign autozone has by the way. Sell more parts and never have to figure out the problem. I digress.

 

I do find it interesting that after 30 years and being a master tech that you've never found a place that appreciates you. I can't imagine why. I would hire an ASE Master with smog in a heartbeat and I pay well. And yes, I'm one of the "greedy bastards" that you're referring to. Funny thing though, I've had the same employees for 13 years. I charge more than the dealers and yet my lot is full and my next opening isn't till next week.

 

So we have taken the union option off the table, you've been a shop owner ( that didn't work however you can understand the troubles that small business ownerships have) and you've been in the business for 30 years. What is another option?

 

I don't give away diag time and I also don't pay flat rate. I feel that shops that don't charge for inspections and testing are hurting our image and are part of the problem.

 

 

PS, I have taken a blue pill, it's a great time !

[slowtech]

Sounds like the usual auto repair devils triangle. Techs complain that greedy shop owners make all the money and under pay techs.

Shop owners say customers won't pay decent rates to cover the cost of quality repair. Customers feel techs rip them off at every

turn of the wrench. It's a silly merry go round. At some point you have to jump off and get on the ride that makes you happy.

Edited August 18, 2015 by slowtech

[stowintegrity]

Sounds like the usual auto repair devils triangle. Techs complain that greedy shop owners make all the money and under pay techs.

Shop owners say customers won't pay decent rates to cover the cost of quality repair. Customers feel techs rip them off at every

turn of the wrench. It's a silly merry go round. At some point you have to jump off and get on the ride that makes you happy.

 

Slowtech, I think I love you. I'd like to hire ten more team members with your temperament, I think.

 

I make more than my lead tech. I make more than all my technicians combined. But then again, I'm responsible for ALL the costs associated with running the business, including the mistakes made by the great staff of people I employ.

 

I honestly believe that me, my customers, and my technicians are all in this together:

 

1. My staff works hard to educate my customers so they'll understand why I don't advertise "We work cheap",

and they're happy to see the results of that effort everytime they come to me for service.

 

2. I work hard to make sure my staff knows how much their skills and expertise is appreciated, and they

know that I pay them every penny of the time they earn, the bonuses they accrue, and the wages increases

they deserve as they hone their skills.

 

3. My customers learn quickly that we're the ones in the room that are workiing hard for THEM, and that the concepts of fast service,

inexpensive service, and quality service are all mutually exclusive. They're happy to expect (and GET) what they pay for.

 

I wouldn't trade my customers OR my staff for anyone else in the marketplace.

[skm]

What a touchy topic, I my self know all too well about the "gravy tech" . In my case though I am a Master ASE certified tech with my L1, State inspection license and master emissions license. Have worked at the same station for 24 years, seen tons of "techs" and 5 owners come and go. I have really seen a decline in the business and the way business is done over the years. Our gravy tech is a 21 year old kid knows nothing about cars, never had any schooling or formal training. has worked on cars for the last year and a half. He is really bad for business in many ways, and is paid the same as me 50% commission, now yes I make more money than him, but that is not the point. You don't practice as a doctor and get paid as a doctor and try to learn as you go by googling or youtubing how to be a doctor. You go to medical school do your residency then practice, finally making it as a doctor and getting paid the correct amount. I have recently really gotten on the owners case about him and how the shop runs with a bunch of parts changers and thieves. I told him I am not going to put up with it much more and that the kid needs to go to school and he should be paid 400 a week flat before taxes if he doesn't like it let him walk there are plenty of others who would love that money, the only reason I see he gets the pay he does is because he is from the same country and same religion, now these things should never ever play into someones business approach. I have let the owner know how I feel and that thing need to change fast or he is going to go under and I will leave, I explained to him your shop is only as good as the weakest link , surround your self with at least good to decent techs and you have a fighting chance. In the last few months I have contemplated opening my own business, I have plenty of customer base that would follow so that is not a problem, I have many years of actually being involved with the shop in all aspects, so I think I really have a very good fighting chance at making a very profitable business. The only things I am afraid of is the slow start up, and always worrying about the business, as it stands now I can leave work at work. I think I am going to hang in there as long as I can take it ! As I look for a business that I can buy out or someone that is failing not due to location but due to bad techs and bad business approach and wants out where I can take over for a reasonable cost. With that being said I have found that when you work for someone that has no Idea about how a automotive repair shop should run you really can only lend them a hand and beat it into their heads that they are going to loose the business like the four several owners before him unless changes are made. If they don't want to take the advice well, it is just time to move on and let them sink. It is just hard after being somewhere for so long and watching it thrive and fall. All I can say is just be you, take care of your customers, be like me let the gravy tech and the owner know how you feel and in my case that is a daily thing with the gravy tech beating it into his head how he is not a mechanic knows nothing and needs to go to school, I prove it to him on a daily basis. Don't be too harsh but harsh enough to let them know you are for real. anyway good luck with everyone's ventures. Stay strong and be the strongest link in the chain. give a man a fish he will eat for a day teach him to fish he will eat for a life time = take a customer for all you can when they come in you will get a chunk of money one time and your business will then fail. treat them right they will keep giving you money for a very long time and your business with thrive.

Edited August 29, 2015 by skm

[bsb1264]

Wow, I have not been on here in a long time and didn't realize all the responses. Slowtech, well put. I wrote this 2 years ago, well I have moved to a completley different state, and have been working at a new dealership for 2 years now. Now, I know you need the lower payed techs, I think why I take it personally is just because the type of person I am. When I first started doing this I was ready to make money! EVERY oppurtunity I had to watch or even help one of the older jedimaster techs do something, I was there. Thats how I learned. I wasn't afraid to jump into a job and I wasn't afraid to ask questions, stupid and logical. lol. As the years go by, the harder I worked, the better I became.And I bet 99.9% of you guys were the same way, you wanted to succeed. In no way shape or form am I a arrogant person, I will never stop learning from the older guys or anyone as a matter of fact. I think the way I see it now, is the generation after me comming up. I just don't see guys have that drive or passion to want to improve themselves, they all want the easy way out and all the handouts. I am not trying to be disrispectful but In my personal expereince have never met a good technician come out of these high dollar trade schools. I would tell younger guys, lube techs, "hey would you like to come see how to time up a timing belt?" the usual response...."No thanks, im good" Now, I'm not saying everyone is like this, but I think a majority of them are just plain lazy. I am now at a shop and there is only 4 of us, 1 lube tech and 3 techs, and we all make the same hours every week (flat rate) and I am payed what I should be payed for my skills. A lot has to do with where I use to work. But the merry go around is true, and the problem now is, the older guys are retiring and there are to many few good technicians filling those places.

[alfredauto]

Honestly, if I had to go back to work for someone I'd hide my ASE card and just do brakes starters alternators and 4 cyl tune ups at a chain store for flat rate. Sorry boss I'm not too good with diagnosis. Sorry boss I don't know how to fix anything, but I'm real good at part changing. If I can bill 300% doing gravy, and assuming theres a steady stream of gravy (and there is) why bother doing anything even remotely hard? Let the other guy be the hero.

 

Now in my shop I don't do just gravy. I wish I could, but I can't afford to send long time customers to my competitors. There are some things I don't do - I have enough work where I don't have to do head gaskets, and I don't like doing them. I know how, but experience taught me that an engine that was full of milky oil isn't really that good even after the gasket is fixed.