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ASE As A Job Requirement?

Joe Marconi
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CARMandP Proficient

CARMandP

Posted
Posted

I am starting this in my shop for the same reason. I personally have had the certifications for years and want my guys to have the same pride for these tests.

Alex

Alex

Posted
Posted

I just recertified last week for my A4, A5, C1, & P2 exams and it was my first time doing it at a prometrics test center on a computer. I have to say I was impressed and got my results immediately. :D

LinconlnAutoRepair Rookie

LinconlnAutoRepair

Posted
Posted

I've tried to implement this practice, but find a lot of "techs" don't have ASE. The sad thing is, a LOT of people that turn their apps in are older 30-50 and have a ton of experience, just never bothered to take the test or thing it's too hard. I personally don't get it, I started getting ASE as fast/soon as I could because at my first real mechanic job, the boss did the same thing as Joe. $1/hr raise for every cert and pay for the test. I've tried offering it to my lube techs, but they don't have the drive for it.

 

I think it should be a requirement to hire, because I am seeing way to many kids coming from the trade schools with no common knowledge and weak diagnostic skills. Then again, if ASE was easy, everyone would have them.

Silver Star Apprentice

Silver Star

Posted
Posted

What suggestions does anyone have regarding techs that have a tough time passing the tests. To sum it up I have a tech that will take ASE tests when I ask him to but tells me that I'm wasting my money because he won't pass. He takes tests and just barely fails. I have offered everything I can think of to get him past that hump. He is very smart and knows his way around vehicles and diagnosing them, and I dont see replacement as a proper solution because I have seen many techs that are laughable compared to this guy over the years. I think he just freezes during the testing or just gets overwhelmed. I have not put pressure on him to do them, only that I pay for the tests and that when he passes we give him a raise for each test past. Any thoughts or things that have worked for other shop owners out there?

CARMandP Proficient

CARMandP

Posted
Posted

If you want to make that a requirement, do it for going forward hires to help weed out the ones you don't want. Not everyone will be able to pass them. You know the tech and his ability and I think you already answered that question for yourself.

Silver Star Apprentice

Silver Star

Posted
Posted

Joe, so you know I value your opinions and advise, this just goes to show why I'm on this forum and continue to read, post, and learn from it. I'm going to keep working with my tech but the last few sentences about the nay sayers is halarious because that is the exact argument I get from him about it.

 

CARMandP,

 

I agree going forward I will be making this a requirement.

 

I have come across the same issue. The way I look at it is this. If I went to the doctor for a pain in my knee and he wants to do surgery, how would I feel if that doctor never past a test on knee surgery? Oh, I know he knows his stuff, but he can't pass a test?

 

If this tech is very smart and works on cars every day, why can't he pass an ASE Test? Those tests are not designed to trick you, they are designed to qualify you that you are certified to work in your field.

 

Part of reason we lack the respect and image we deserve is that we don't hold all the people in our industry to the standards we have.

 

If a tech is a good tech, get him or her the help, the training to pass the ASE tests. For me it's that's simple. I know the naysayers will say that a test does not prove a tech can do the job and that some that pass the test are just good test takers. My answer to that is the next time you need a doctor, just go to someone who is good in medicine, but one that never passed a test in medicine.

ATLAuto Rising Star

ATLAuto

Posted
Posted

I'm in the process of opening a shop up right now. In preparing for opening, I decided that I had better get ASE certified myself if I am going to require techs to be certified. So, I went out and took all 8 ASE tests at a Prometric Center and passed all but the 2 transmission tests.

 

Through this, I came to understand what ASE tests entail. They are a mixture of "book knowledge" and "troubleshooting / practical knowledge." If a tech cannot pass one of the tests, he will typically blame it on the fact that he doesn't have all this "book knowledge." Fair enough. None of us can memorize it all, especially now that AllData and Identifix have it readily available. However, in the ASE tests that I took, only 5-10% of the questions relied on memorized information, so not a very valid excuse with the 70% to pass criteria.

 

The other 90-95% of the questions involved "troubleshooting / practical knowledge." This is where I have a difficult time sympathizing with any tech not able or willing to pass an ASE test. Techs deal with troubleshooting situations ALL DAY LONG. These ASE questions are nothing but the paper version of their daily job. Additionally, the questions are simplified, idealized, and put in the most basic format possible. A tech could only DREAM of getting a vehicle in their bay with such a straight-forward issue.

 

A final excuse would be the cost of the study materials and the tests. Study materials ran me around $100 for all 8. The tests ran another $300 for all 8 (I may be a bit off on this). In total, that's $400 to become a "Certified Master Technician." $400. Let's put that cost in perspective. In any other industry, certification is going to costs thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to complete. Our industry? On the job training and a few hundred bucks to take the tests. I'm not saying don't reimburse techs for this cost. I will certainly be doing that. However, just put it in perspective.

 

In short, I'm going to agree on this one. Techs should come in the door with ASE or be moving toward it.

FROGFINDER Rising Star

FROGFINDER

Posted
Posted

A true professional passes his ASE tests even if they don't feel like it. Listen to your staffs words. If you hear

"I don't care,I don't know, Questions that could have been answered with 2 minutes research on the databases you pay for,Talk about after hours drug/achohol abuse, womanizer talk ,cursing that should give you a clue. It all starts with the heart and soul. B)

  • 5 months later...
nmikmik Enthusiast

nmikmik

Posted
Posted

What suggestions does anyone have regarding techs that have a tough time passing the tests. To sum it up I have a tech that will take ASE tests when I ask him to but tells me that I'm wasting my money because he won't pass. He takes tests and just barely fails. I have offered everything I can think of to get him past that hump. He is very smart and knows his way around vehicles and diagnosing them, and I dont see replacement as a proper solution because I have seen many techs that are laughable compared to this guy over the years. I think he just freezes during the testing or just gets overwhelmed. I have not put pressure on him to do them, only that I pay for the tests and that when he passes we give him a raise for each test past. Any thoughts or things that have worked for other shop owners out there?

There plenty of places that help techs just like the one in question here, to pass the test.

http://www.tests.com/ASE-A1-Engine-Repair-Practice-Test

Just have another tech smack him upside the head (you as a boss are not allowed unfortunately :wub: ) to get the fear out of his thinking. If he takes the mock tests enough times and feels how easy they are, he will pass on the first try. I think that time constrain causes some people (ahem yours trully) to freeze, again practicing the test helps with that as well - tremendously.

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  • Have you checked out Joe's Latest Blog?

    • Joe Marconi
      The Technician Shortage Is Our Fault, And It's Time We Own It
      By Joe Marconi in Joe's Blog
         0 comments
      The Technician Shortage Is Our Fault, And It's Time We Own It
      Nearly every day, I hear shop owners complain: "There's a technician shortage. We can't find qualified people. There's no one out there." If that's true, then who's to blame?
      The industry? The schools? The government? I don't know how you feel, but who promised us an endless supply of qualified technicians?
      Another common complaint is that young people do not want to work in the trades. Well, if that were true, then why are other trades such as HVAC, electrical, and plumbing growing? What are they doing that the automotive industry is not? 
      Here's the reality we need to face: We do have a problem, but we shouldn't look for someone or any entity to rescue us. Not the government. Not the trade schools. Not the recruiting companies. No one owes us a workforce. If we want great people in our industry, it's up to us. At some point, we need to own up to the truth: Building a pipeline of qualified technicians is our responsibility.
      In this blog article, I will break down the key reasons we are in this situation today and what we, as an industry, can do to solve the technician shortage. Are you ready to look in the mirror?
      Have We Pushed Technicians Away?
      Let's take a look at flat-rate pay. True flat rate, which pays a technician only for the hours they produce, is a controversial pay plan that emphasizes high production levels and creates a competitive work environment that, if not properly controlled, can lead to increased mistakes and a decline in morale and team spirit. Additionally, the stress and physical demands placed on technicians as they age are not favorable to long-term employee retention. What do we do with technicians as they grow older into their fifties and begin to slow down? 
      I have heard all the arguments and pros and cons of flat-rate pay, and I am not going to judge any pay plan. Let the facts speak for themselves. True flat rate has changed in most areas around the country and has evolved into a pay plan that gives technicians some pay guarantee.
      Many shop owners have learned that team morale, along with the opportunity to earn income, is important to technicians and to the company's long-term success. But let me ask you: how many technicians have left or been pushed out over the years because of the old flat-rate pay system?
      Another issue is the workplace environment. I remember being grateful to be hired as a young technician at a local repair shop. While very thankful, the work environment was not ideal. The shop owner kept the bay doors open year-round (I am from New York) unless it rained or snowed. He felt that if the bay doors were closed, customers might think we were closed for business. We had no heat and no hot water. Many of the jobs were done outside, year-round,  in all types of weather. The starting pay was minimum wage, with no benefits, sick days, or vacation pay. 
      Now, again, I need to point out that I was truly grateful for the opportunity this shop owner gave me. I learned a lot working there, and the experience was pivotal in my career. But looking back, I wonder how many people were discouraged by these working conditions?
      While the physical demands of the repair workplace are daunting, perhaps even more critical is the culture. Too many of my generation shop owners preached the mindset of "my way or the highway." We were the business owners, after all. We started our companies, took all the risks, and provided jobs. Why shouldn't we be the ones to set the ground rules our way?   
      Many of us found over the years that the "my way or the highway" mentality was a sure way to isolate employees and make them more likely to look over the fence for greener grass. In other words, it led many technicians to seek employment elsewhere, where they felt they could be appreciated and recognized for their hard work. The issue, however, was that there wasn't much green grass around. Disappointment after disappointment, bouncing from repair to repair shop, eventually led to despair. So, I ask you: were workplace conditions a contributing factor in today's technician shortage?
      Another factor that we are all well aware of is the complexity of the modern automobile. When I started, the work was mostly physical, and you were required to master essentially three vehicle models: General Motors, Ford, and Chrysler. Let's fast-forward to today. The evolution of automotive technology, along with the extensive training and tools required, has outpaced the typical technician's pay compensation, with no clear career path. Again, leading to frustration and insecurity about the future.
      Here is the bottom line: people don't leave their job; they leave their experience. We must do a better job. 
      The News Isn't all Bad; Your Next Steps to Fix the Technician Shortage
      To fix the technician shortage, it will take a combined effort from everyone in the automotive industry, particularly automotive shop owners. Shop owners are in the perfect position to make the greatest impact, not only on their businesses but also on the future automotive workforce.
      First, shop owners must become better leaders and understand that their ultimate success is directly dependent on the people they assemble around them. Any shop owner who mistakenly believes they can build an empire solely on their abilities is destined for serious disappointment. Business owners who think like this will eventually plateau. Without the collective contributions from a team of qualified people, your business will stall; it will not continue to grow.
      Create a workplace that attracts top talent: a clean, professional, well-equipped facility designed to support productivity, teamwork, and a career, not just a job. Build a great reputation in your community by getting involved locally. Become the auto repair shop that people take notice of as "the" place to work.
      Next, shop owners must become more financially knowledgeable. Knowing your numbers and what you need to achieve for a strong bottom-line profit is essential to paying technicians the money they need and deserve. Profit will also allow you to compete with other trade industries by providing a benefits package that has real take-home value and security.
      When it comes to culture, this is where the rubber hits the road. People crave recognition, praise, and a sense of purpose. Despite what you hear, people are not just money-motivated. Once people feel secure in their financial situation, retaining and motivating technicians can only be achieved by connecting with them on an emotional level. You cannot show enough appreciation. Give out praise for a job well done as if your business depended on it, because it does.
      As technicians age, we need to have a place for them. Expecting a 58-year-old to perform like a 35-year-old is unrealistic. We need to be more focused on career pathing. Provide training, skill development, and coaching to develop leaders and mentors within our older workforce. While their bodies may have slowed, the knowledge they have gained is priceless. 
      Our future is dependent on young people entering our industry. We need to give more young people opportunities. Every shop owner across the country should consider hiring an apprentice, then build an apprentice training plan and career path for them. If every shop did this, we could solve the technician shortage within five years. Get involved with the trade schools and high schools in your area. Look into the NAPA Apprenticeship Program. Don't sit on your hands with this one. Do it today.
      Lastly, don't get left behind. Commit to ongoing training for all your employees. Keep up to date with tools and equipment tailored to your business model. Don't try to be all things to all people and all vehicles. Identify your core profile customer and the vehicles they drive, and become an expert on those vehicles and the services you offer.

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