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Apples to Apples - - - - Cheap parts-good parts-- is there a difference? Now, explain that to cost concerned customer.

Gonzo

By Gonzo
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Gonzo Grand Master

Gonzo

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Apples to Apples

 

 

 

Alternators, Starters, Voltage Regulators, Window motor assemblies, Light Bulbs, Serpentine belts, the list goes on and on of the various cheaply made replacement parts out there. Being able to distinguish what parts are good or bad is part of being a professional in this crazy world of automotive repair.

 

A customer calls in wanting prices on a certain job, and more than likely this isn't the first phone call they've made today. The way I can tell this is by the way they answer certain questions I ask. This is in order to narrow down the options on that particular part or job. "What's the motor size, is it 2 or 4 door, automatic or manual?" If these questions aren't a hit and miss answer chances are they've been through this before, and have a pretty good idea what the cost is… or at least what they've found out from the auto parts cheapo depot.

 

"Yes, I need a price on an alternator for my car," the caller asks.

 

I give them a price for the brands I sell, and before I'm even finished they'll tell me how much the last guy would sell the part for. That's fine, I know everyone is looking for a bargain, and shopping around for prices is all part of it. However, let's compare apples to apples… not just prices to prices.

 

A perfect example of this is the common external regulator for a Ford product. The prices will range from just a few bucks to as much as 30 dollars. The difference is the quality, of course. You can tell the difference for yourself by just picking them up. The cheap regulator feels like a feather compared to the more expensive one. The question is... do they both work? Yes they do, but there's no doubt the cheaper one will not take any abuse, or a fluctuating signal, or load variations as well as the better made part. No doubt the cheaper one is going to need replaced sooner than you think.

 

From the professional side, it takes just as long to diagnose a problem and make the repair with a well manufactured part as it does to put on one of those bottom of the barrel parts. The big difference is you only have to do the job once, rather than over and over again. That eats up diagnostic time, shop time, and doesn't make for a very happy customer.

 

Over the years the number of times I've had someone bring a car in and tell me they have put five or six alternators on the car, and it still doesn't work is beyond comprehension. The unsuspecting customer will almost certainly have the same reaction on the phone or at the service counter.

 

"There has to be something electrically wrong with the car," they'll say.

 

Even though I haven't checked the car out yet, I'll still ask them, "Where are you buying your parts?"

 

Nine chances out of ten they are buying the cheap knock off brands because of the cost, and under certain applications these knock off brands fail constantly.

 

By the time I get the car in the shop and run the needed tests, I'm already stretching their pocket book just to give them the answer I already assumed it would be.

 

"It's a cheap part that's causing the problem," I'll tell them, and when I give them the price of the "quality" part I know I'm in for an argument.

 

"It shouldn't cost that much. I'll just go get another one myself," the now ticked off customer will tell me. It could be they really wanted me to find something else wrong with it, because they know it can't be the part. Then again, it could be because they don't want to change it again. Whichever the case may be... I'm the lucky guy taking the brunt of the customer's melt down at the front counter.

 

Why is it that the second largest purchase most people make in their life time is left to using cheap discount parts as a way to keep their family truckster on the road? You know, if the original manufacturer used some of these discount parts most of those cars wouldn't make it from the manufacturer to the show room floor without breaking down.

 

One morning when I arrived at the shop a customer was waiting for me with a rear main seal for me to see. I had just replaced the seal in his car a few weeks earlier. There wasn't a problem with the car, his problem was that he believed that I over charged him for the seal. While he was at one of those discount parts stores he purchased a rear seal himself, and after having some time to think about it he figured I should know just how ticked off he was. Needless to say, now he's thinking every bit of the labor cost must have been exaggerated as well.

 

There was only one way that I could think of to solve this problem. I called my supplier and had them send down another seal just like the original one I had purchased. With the customer standing in front of me, we took both of the seals out of their boxes and laid them on the counter.

 

"You see, they are actually the same," the aggravated customer tells me, "They're the same color, same design and obviously are identical, you over charged me!"

 

I'll admit they looked the same, and I was getting a little worried that I wouldn't find a difference between the two of them. I wanted to prove my point that not all parts are created equal, but how? As this anger management class dropout started to get even more steamed up, he started to make his point known how he felt about mechanics in general, parts stores, and the world at large. I picked the two seals up while he was standing on his soap box proudly putting down anyone who had anything to do with the car business. When I gently snapped the actual seal area that touches the crank shaft back and forth ... I had the answer... the difference was obvious.

 

"Sir, if you'll calm down a minute I'll show you the difference. The one you brought from the discount part store has fewer coils on the retaining spring. This spring is what keeps the rubber seal up against the crankshaft to prevent any leaks. Look at the one I just purchased, and you'll see it has twice as many coils on the spring," I calmly explained to him. (OK, I "tried" to say it calmly)

 

After a bit of scrutiny on his part he did see the difference between the two so called "exact" parts. He apologized for all his belligerent ranting, and said he would make good on his promise not to buy any more parts based on the dollar amount. I hope so... sure would make my day go a lot smoother.

 

These days with even more parts coming in from different parts of the world, and at different quality levels, the tech has to be on his toes to make sure what they are installing on a customer's car is actually a decent component. Even today, I'll do my best to sway the customer into buying quality parts rather than going the cheap route. If they insist on using a cheaper part, I'll be the first to tell them what the results will be.

 

Comparing apples to apples is still a good method of explaining things to someone who might have a difference of opinion. One bad apple doesn't spoil the whole bunch, even good parts fail sometimes. But I'd put my money on a quality part any day of the week. Service is the name of the game in the automotive repair business; knowing which "apple" is the right one for your car is just another part of the service good shops provide. There are plenty of apples out there in the orchard, and sorting out the bad ones aren't about who has the best TV commercial or newspaper ad. Ask a mechanic, he'll know the difference between good parts and bad ones. As the old saying goes; "Ya get what ya paid for."

 

 

Cheap parts are so common these days, with the economy on the low ... seems everyone is going low with the parts and labor prices. It's to bad more people won't listen to the mechanic vs listening to the guy behind the parts counter. Some do... some don't.

Keep those comments coming!


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Gonzo Grand Master

Gonzo

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:rolleyes: Cars and people... people and parts ... in some cases I wish you had to be liscenced to buy certian parts and components.
Gonzo Grand Master

Gonzo

Posted
  • Author
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... My wife read your comment Joe, here response , ya nailed it!!

FxsX24 Apprentice

FxsX24

Posted
Posted

Without even reading the whole article I feel where you come from. When i have a customer in the store or on the phone, they want the cheapest one. They dont care about the warranty, the cost (or hassle in DIY) of replacing the part, possible tire wear, possible realignment costs (60-80 here).

It is hard to get people to spend money on good parts.

people will buy the cheapest oil and air filters they can, cheapest wipers possible.

 

 

 

 

Fed Mogul has changed (at aap atleast) the National name to MOOG. Same part (well same stampings on them), new box.

 

 

What we found found was that the right front hub bearing was about to fall off of the truck. The customer later told me that the guy who did the bearings told him they were "Moog". I told my customer that as far as our area I have not saw any "Moog" hub bearing assemblies and don't know that Moog sells them but the well known brands are BCA, National, Timken, etc.

/quote]

Silver Star Apprentice

Silver Star

Posted
Posted

Sounds like thsi thread needs to be a brain storming session to come up with an answer of how to deal with the "cheap" price shoppers. I agree that we should concentrate on the quality of work, people are more willing to spend for quality as long as they can see or at least understand it. Our business is basically selling the invisible to people and most of these people are probally the "i have to see it to believe it" We also can't wait around for everyone to have failures form cheap parts to learn the hardway.

 

Has anyone started any process or come up with a script of what to tell these people in as few words as possible? Maby a simple phrase like "you get what you pay for" is our secret weapon?

 

I will think about this and see if I cna come up with anything.

milesauto Newbie

milesauto

Posted
Posted

Good subject.

We are having more and more issues with the quality of parts. Last week we replaced a clutch on a Neon. Next day customer was back with a miss at idle that he did not experience prior to our working on it. After compression test and checking what we had done I felt like we were going the wrong direction. Iit felt more like a vibration to me. So I had my tech pull it back apart and just for grins went ahead and installed another clutch. That took care of the problem and hopefully we salvaged a customer.

 

Prior to redoing the clutch I had called the manufacturer technical help line to see if they had ever heard of this problem with this application. I really had not run into this problem before. Of course all I got was "no" never had the first one come back. OBTW this clutch is the integeral type that the flywheel is with the unit and its all riveted together. No way to bolt in wrong...only goes one way. I guess they figure that that a balance of the unit would drive the cost up too much and really is not nessary. Well only if you want it done correctly.

 

So I called the manufacturer back to tell them they may be seeing a problem with their clutch products. I also asked them about all the "made in China" markings on there product. Asked them if they even make clutches in this country anymore. The anwser was a matter of fact ...NO..Borg Warner no longer makes clutches. They just import the clutches and put it their boxes. Not much different from the other used to be big names. No.... I did not get a sorry you had a problem or any offer of help with that labor. No all I got was.... where did you buy that unit? Couldn't wait to get me off their phone.

 

So the next time a Neon comes in for a clutch and we quote a O.E. from the dealer and the customer decines the repair and goes down the street to competitor .......at least I will have not lost my labor cost.

FxsX24 Apprentice

FxsX24

Posted
Posted

Good subject.

We are having more and more issues with the quality of parts. Last week we replaced a clutch on a Neon. Next day customer was back with a miss at idle that he did not experience prior to our working on it. After compression test and checking what we had done I felt like we were going the wrong direction. Iit felt more like a vibration to me. So I had my tech pull it back apart and just for grins went ahead and installed another clutch. That took care of the problem and hopefully we salvaged a customer.

 

Prior to redoing the clutch I had called the manufacturer technical help line to see if they had ever heard of this problem with this application. I really had not run into this problem before. Of course all I got was "no" never had the first one come back. OBTW this clutch is the integeral type that the flywheel is with the unit and its all riveted together. No way to bolt in wrong...only goes one way. I guess they figure that that a balance of the unit would drive the cost up too much and really is not nessary. Well only if you want it done correctly.

 

So I called the manufacturer back to tell them they may be seeing a problem with their clutch products. I also asked them about all the "made in China" markings on there product. Asked them if they even make clutches in this country anymore. The anwser was a matter of fact ...NO..Borg Warner no longer makes clutches. They just import the clutches and put it their boxes. Not much different from the other used to be big names. No.... I did not get a sorry you had a problem or any offer of help with that labor. No all I got was.... where did you buy that unit? Couldn't wait to get me off their phone.

 

So the next time a Neon comes in for a clutch and we quote a O.E. from the dealer and the customer decines the repair and goes down the street to competitor .......at least I will have not lost my labor cost.

 

 

does your supplier not offer warranty labor reimbursement?

jeffg Apprentice

jeffg

Posted
Posted

Good article, sent it out to my key personnel. One of the guys replied that the title should be "Apples to Autozone"

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      The Technician Shortage Is Our Fault, And It's Time We Own It
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      Many shop owners have learned that team morale, along with the opportunity to earn income, is important to technicians and to the company's long-term success. But let me ask you: how many technicians have left or been pushed out over the years because of the old flat-rate pay system?
      Another issue is the workplace environment. I remember being grateful to be hired as a young technician at a local repair shop. While very thankful, the work environment was not ideal. The shop owner kept the bay doors open year-round (I am from New York) unless it rained or snowed. He felt that if the bay doors were closed, customers might think we were closed for business. We had no heat and no hot water. Many of the jobs were done outside, year-round,  in all types of weather. The starting pay was minimum wage, with no benefits, sick days, or vacation pay. 
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      While the physical demands of the repair workplace are daunting, perhaps even more critical is the culture. Too many of my generation shop owners preached the mindset of "my way or the highway." We were the business owners, after all. We started our companies, took all the risks, and provided jobs. Why shouldn't we be the ones to set the ground rules our way?   
      Many of us found over the years that the "my way or the highway" mentality was a sure way to isolate employees and make them more likely to look over the fence for greener grass. In other words, it led many technicians to seek employment elsewhere, where they felt they could be appreciated and recognized for their hard work. The issue, however, was that there wasn't much green grass around. Disappointment after disappointment, bouncing from repair to repair shop, eventually led to despair. So, I ask you: were workplace conditions a contributing factor in today's technician shortage?
      Another factor that we are all well aware of is the complexity of the modern automobile. When I started, the work was mostly physical, and you were required to master essentially three vehicle models: General Motors, Ford, and Chrysler. Let's fast-forward to today. The evolution of automotive technology, along with the extensive training and tools required, has outpaced the typical technician's pay compensation, with no clear career path. Again, leading to frustration and insecurity about the future.
      Here is the bottom line: people don't leave their job; they leave their experience. We must do a better job. 
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      Next, shop owners must become more financially knowledgeable. Knowing your numbers and what you need to achieve for a strong bottom-line profit is essential to paying technicians the money they need and deserve. Profit will also allow you to compete with other trade industries by providing a benefits package that has real take-home value and security.
      When it comes to culture, this is where the rubber hits the road. People crave recognition, praise, and a sense of purpose. Despite what you hear, people are not just money-motivated. Once people feel secure in their financial situation, retaining and motivating technicians can only be achieved by connecting with them on an emotional level. You cannot show enough appreciation. Give out praise for a job well done as if your business depended on it, because it does.
      As technicians age, we need to have a place for them. Expecting a 58-year-old to perform like a 35-year-old is unrealistic. We need to be more focused on career pathing. Provide training, skill development, and coaching to develop leaders and mentors within our older workforce. While their bodies may have slowed, the knowledge they have gained is priceless. 
      Our future is dependent on young people entering our industry. We need to give more young people opportunities. Every shop owner across the country should consider hiring an apprentice, then build an apprentice training plan and career path for them. If every shop did this, we could solve the technician shortage within five years. Get involved with the trade schools and high schools in your area. Look into the NAPA Apprenticeship Program. Don't sit on your hands with this one. Do it today.
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      If any of this sounds familiar, I put together a free Operations Assessment Checklist that walks through these and a few other common bottlenecks — grab it at gettractionops.com/checklist. No email required, just download and use it.
      Curious what systems others here have put in place — especially around the approval/follow-up piece. That one seems to be the biggest variable shop to shop.
    • nptrb
      How Auto Repair Shop Owners Should Pay Themselves (And Why Being Last Is a Problem)
      By nptrb

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    • Changing The Industry
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