Times are a changing?

[quinn49]

Seems like lately we have been working out a lot of estimates without getting the job. Sometimes i feel like were wasting a lot of time to sit down and work these out.

Are we getting to detailed when doing this? I have learned to try and secure a appointment before giving a estimate, but that does not seem to work either. I'm not looking to land all the Customer's that call, but some would be nice!! More and more we are seeing people want to supply their own parts. In the past we never did this. Is it time to start thinking about changing how a CSP (customer supplied part) job is handled?

 

Looking for any thoughts

Thanks Jim Quinn

[ScottyP]

I charge an additional 25% labor if they supply their own parts and there is no warranty. I strongly discourage customer supplied parts and usually win.

[mmotley]

I simply don't mark my parts up as much, so a customer is less inclined to supply their own parts. If they still insist on bringing their own parts, no warranty is offered with the work.

[ATSAutomotive]

We simply do not do customer supplied parts. It never seems to work out. Customer has the wrong part when you have it torn apart. If that part fails who looks like the bad guy? My business model is setup to achieve a certain profit percentage every year. My business model also dictates what I need to sell my labor for, my parts, etc. Advance, O'Reillys, Autozone, etc have been around a long time. The times will only change when shops continue to allow customers to bring their own parts. I simply do not understand why people worry about that so much. What in the world do you buy that isn't marked up! If you are looking for customers who are solely looking for price, it looks like you found them. I'll continue to work with customers who are looking for great service.

 

To the OP, we stopped doing estimates over the phone. We simply ask when they would like to bring the car in for us to take a look at it. I can't diagnose the car over the phone and I certainly want to make my own inquiry in to what the vehicle needs.

 

Had a guy call today asking for a price to fix his driver's rear window on a 2001 Pontiac Bonneville. I asked when he would like to bring it in. His response was "I'm just looking for a price to fix the window". I explained to him that I cannot possibly give him an estimate if I don't know what's wrong with the car. "Well the window won't roll up or down" I understand that sir but is it a wiring issue, did the switch go bad, is the regulator broken, or did the motor go out? His answer, I don't know. Well I don't know either, that's why I need to see your car and diagnose what the issue is. To the point, this person was calling around asking for prices and seeing who was the cheapest. The cheap customer is not YOUR ideal customer. Your ideal customer is someone who calls saying my window wont roll up or down. When could you guys take a look at it? I use to take all of the price shoppers. I simply don't do it now and my business in a much better place because of it. My price is my price, I DO charge for diagnostics. I didn't build it, buy it or break it. I simply service it.

 

Next time they ask if they can get an estimate. Sure! When would you like to bring it in? Cut down on our estimate making, not our sales. You spend 90% of your time with your worst customers and 10% with your best.....

 

Just my thoughts gentlemen and woman, take it or leave it.

[Jeff]

Most people DO NOT KNOW what to ask other than price. In one of the seminars I attended the instructor made a very good point. YOU PAY GOOD MONEY TO MAKE THE PHONE RING! To that end I will give them a best/worst case. Then I go after the appointment. Some ya can get in, others will go down the street.

I have been doing customer supplied parts with the disclaimers and an increase in labor. I also have been offering "recycled" parts as an inexpensive alternative. I am doing whatever within reason to keep the dollars flowing. Things are beginning to pick up a little around here but it still ain't what it was 5-6 years ago!

[xrac]

Depending upon the requested quote I will often avoid giving a price or may throw out a price range. About 40% of the time price quote requests are based upon incorrect assumptions that are a waste of everybodies time. I will often try to engage the customer in a conversation and get them talking. I make them laugh if I can. I ask questions. "How do you know you need a thermostat? It could be a something as simple as a low cooling system caused by a loose hose clamp. We fixed an overheating car a couple of weeks ago by installing a new radiator cap. A cooling system pressure test is only $14.95. Why don't you bring it in and let us find what is really wrong with it." What I am doing is building rapport, causing them to relax, offering hope that things could be not as bad as they may think, and I am not shooting out a price or trying to sell them something. I get them asking for me by name when they walk through the door.

[ATSAutomotive]

http://workshop.search-autoparts.com/_Cust-Supplied-Parts-Liability-AGAIN/blog/6565245/31710.html?cid=95914

 

Article about customer supplied parts and your liability for them. Just came in my email today from MotorAge magazine. It's just not worth it.

[Jeff]

Interesting article. May have to revisit the customer supplied thing again!

[xrac]

http://workshop.search-autoparts.com/_Cust-Supplied-Parts-Liability-AGAIN/blog/6565245/31710.html?cid=95914

 

Article about customer supplied parts and your liability for them. Just came in my email today from MotorAge magazine. It's just not worth it.

Thanks for posting it. It us definitely though provoking.

[CAautogroup]

We have the same problem at our shop. Have our phone shoppers keeping us busy all day with estimates. We also have several customers insisting on bringing in their own parts, and yet they still cry about the labor price.

 

We are thinking of adding a page to our website for estimates. When customer calls, we ask that they go online and fill out the estimate request form. I feel as of though this will set apart true customers and those who only care about the price. Taking an extra minute or two to will out a form is nothing compared to having the customer hold on the phone, keeping your lines busy, and even your staff during rush hours.

 

Any thoughts or opinions regarding this approach? Or has anyone used this idea, if so what were the results?

[rjbradlow]

Markets vary and what works great for some may not be so hot for others.
I've met some shop owners in highly populated areas where they believe there is no such thing as customer loyalty and they hammer everyone.

The demographics of your surrounding area may be low / fixed income and they need their vehicles for shopping, doctor & pharmacy visits, etc...
Is it fair to hammer or ostracize them?

Yes it's nice to work with first class customers and wouldn't the world be a perfect place if that is all that walked through our doors.
However; I have a diverse mixture from the poverty-stricken to the wealthiest in my area.

Times are changing indeed. They are getting tougher for us because they are getting tougher for our customers and a good deal of these customers are hurting financially.

So who is going to take care of them if we've all focused on only attracting the 10%?

I accept and work with anyone because I know that a great number of people need reliable transportation to survive and many of my customers can barely make ends meet if at all because a spouse became ill or whatever the reason. I know my customers personally and I care about all of them.
This is the business I have built and word of mouth from every station travels the ranks good or bad.

I have and will continue to work well past closing if a customer really needs their car for work and the job ran into overtime.
My customers always come first no matter how much money they may or may not have.
Remember my demographics... I have them all as 'loyal' customers because I am loyal to them and treat them all as people, not numbers.

When we start looking to shove our less fortunate customers out the door with ridiculous policies we are contributing to the problem and ultimately shooting ourselves in the foot.
Why did DIY parts stores become so popular?
Why are our 'Vendors' following suit?

A: Because there are too many shops screwing -or- ostracizing people with ridiculous policies and these people Need their cars repaired so someone is either going to do it themselves or call Bubba Stump.

Why is there only One parts jobber in my state that has the gumption to only sell wholesale to the trade?
Naturally this is my primary vendor of choice, but when they do not have something...

It sure annoys the hell out of me to have to wait on hold while the counter jockeys at any given 'pro' parts store finish with all of those 'price shopping' customers and their shade tree mechanics before I can find out if they have something that is not in their integrated parts catalog that only works by vehicle application in stock.

Do You see where I'm going with this?

Love them all, great and small...
Let them bring their own parts and charge one price, but if it fails charge them twice.
Sure they will call shopping around, but only fools will turn them down.
For every part that walks in the door, dollars will follow as labor abounds.
It's when their cheap crap fails that lessons prevail and you'll be happier for not losing the sale.
By word of mouth you will soon be swimming in a business that has no limits, not even for the poor.

May God bless you all.

Edited May 20, 2014 by rjbradlow

[rjbradlow]

http://workshop.search-autoparts.com/_Cust-Supplied-Parts-Liability-AGAIN/blog/6565245/31710.html?cid=95914

 

Article about customer supplied parts and your liability for them. Just came in my email today from MotorAge magazine. It's just not worth it.

 

And where are these parts coming from?

 

Whether your customer brings you somthing from discount auto or you buy it from 'pro vendor' ... they both are carrying cheap crap made in China.

And who are the top suppliers to all of these chains?

 

You see boys, all of these parts are coming from the same people and are being rebranded. i.e. Re-Boxed

 

If you want to make sure you are not going to be sued then buy the same chinese part in a different box and hang your hat on it.

 

Make your customers bring you receipts for the parts they bought and copy them showing part name, line code, vendor etc. Make customer sign the copy with a staement that they brought the part in from a reputable auto parts store... You know... The same freaking stores You are buying the Same parts from.

 

You the professional shoud be able to recognise the brand name and if Monkey Joe's Auto Parts will sell you both the same part at the same price... They are liable not you.

Show me the parts that are still Made here in the USA.... Not Assembled in the USA!

Show me something that I can buy cheaper than my customer can -- AND -- is made better.

 

WTF

[ncautoshop]

That's great and all but a:I have a family to feed and b:I have a family that I desire to spend every minute possible with.

Work can't consume you're entire life.

Lastly, take it from someone who's almost helped so many people, he almost helped myself out of business - you might genuinely find 1-2 people a month that really need help, but there are hordes of folks who have learned the art of manipulation, maybe even communicate amongst one another to take advantage of those willing to help. Help those who truly need it but remember a good bit of those who come in needing help, might not need it but want it.

 

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2

 

 

[Jeff]

RJ good post. I see you are in Stuart. I am just north in the Fort. I pretty much see it the same way. I try to make it as easy as I can to get your car fixed here. A lot of folks in this area are still hurting from the "recession". Workin folks cant find a job, retirees funds hit hard, property values in the crapper,,,! I feel if I can help them "get by" they will remember me when they are on top again. And if they dont, when I get to the Pearly Gates I can say I tried!

[rjbradlow]

Thank you Jeff and I agree with you ncautoshop... I too have family I like to spend time with and those late night jobs are few and far between. I cannot be all things to all people but I do weed out the bad / abusive customers. A little common sense goes a long way. The moral of my story is that many shops are throwing away business and are contributing to the DIY / BYOP problem. These customers eventually learn after having to pay me to perform the same job several times and then give up on buying their own parts. Meanwhile I've made a profit each time while training them instead of arguing the difference in parts (when there is a difference), let them experience it first hand. Their wallet is often the best teacher... Especially when they are buying the absolute cheapest electrical parts.

--------------------------------- However ....

Some DIY / Bring your own parts customers are pretty resourceful; I had a 2008 Dodge R2500HD Turbo Cummins come in with AC failure and a bunch of codes (some customer generated)...

The clutch coil failed and upon calling around to the dealer, Cold Air Distributors, Bennett, NAPA, CarQuest, et al. I was told each and every time that the clutch/coil assembly was Not available separately and only came with the compressor. So I gave him an estimate for the whole shebang explaining that it was not available w/o the compressor.

He did not accept this answer and said he would get back to me... Sure enough he found a supplier (Air Parts, Inc. in Ocala, FL) that does in fact sell the clutch assembly by itself.

He ordered the part and then dropped everything off including the receipt.

This is a 'wealthy cheap guy' that had I refused as a customer I would not have learned of a new AC parts supplier.

Sure I'm not making money on this part, but I am on others and labor and I've added to my vendor list in the process.

Edited May 20, 2014 by rjbradlow

[ncautoshop]

Thank you Jeff and I agree with you ncautoshop... I too have family I like to spend time with and those late night jobs are few and far between. I cannot be all things to all people but I do weed out the bad / abusive customers. A little common sense goes a long way. The moral of my story is that many shops are throwing away business and are contributing to the DIY / BYOP problem. These customers eventually learn after having to pay me to perform the same job several times and then give up on buying their own parts. Meanwhile I've made a profit each time while training them instead of arguing the difference in parts (when there is a difference), let them experience it first hand. Their wallet is often the best teacher... Especially when they are buying the absolute cheapest electrical parts.

 

--------------------------------- However ....

 

Some DIY / Bring your own parts customers are pretty resourceful; I had a 2008 Dodge R2500HD Turbo Cummins come in with AC failure and a bunch of codes (some customer generated)...

 

The clutch coil failed and upon calling around to the dealer, Cold Air Distributors, Bennett, NAPA, CarQuest, et al. I was told each and every time that the clutch/coil assembly was Not available separately and only came with the compressor. So I gave him an estimate for the whole shebang explaining that it was not available w/o the compressor.

 

He did not accept this answer and said he would get back to me... Sure enough he found a supplier (Air Parts, Inc. in Ocala, FL) that does in fact sell the clutch assembly by itself.

He ordered the part and then dropped everything off including the receipt.

 

This is a 'wealthy cheap guy' that had I refused as a customer I would not have learned of a new AC parts supplier.

 

Sure I'm not making money on this part, but I am on others and labor and I've added to my vendor list in the process.

Agreed completely.

 

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2

 

 

[ScottyP]

I help plenty of people out at my shop. Just last Saturday I had a kid in with a blown brake line. I know him and his family from TKD and I know he doesn't have a lot of money to spend. Did the job for half what I normally charge, and after he saw his rear brakes just hit metal, dug through the pile of brake pads and found a set with half a pad left and stuck them in for him so he could get home and fix the brakes himself.

 

But my experience with customer supplied parts is not good. Last month a guy brought an Audi A4 in for front brakes, and he says parts are in the back. Great. So I do the job and charge normal rate, but I also find upper control arms, tie rod ends, rear wheel bearings, and CV's are all shot, I mean bad, you could rock each wheel an inch. So we schedule the worst of it, 5 hours, of course he says he get the parts. Day comes and he calls 30 minutes after his appointment time, can't make it. Ok crap happens and I had other work I could get in. He reschedules for the next week, day comes and he never shows, doesn't answer his phone and I've not heard from him since. That day I didn't have anything substantial to bring in and only one other appointment, cost me 5 billable hours.

 

This week I had a guy who wanted front brakes on his car, says he'll get the parts. I quoted him labor,which was $30 more than if I supplied parts and he agreed and scheduled the work. Today he called and cancelled. Guess he found someplace cheaper, even though I was highly recommended by two different parts stores and a buddy of his.

 

These are just a couple. In general I have not had good experiences with those who want to bring parts. I try, but they end up hosing me in the end. And it's not like these guys can't afford to pay for the work, it's just that their attitude is nobody's going to make money off them. I'm seriously considering adopting a rule not to install customer supplied parts, and reading the above article leans me even more that way.

[ATSAutomotive]

It seems as if not accepting customer supplied parts makes you a bad guy. It doesn't, there are legal implications of doing this. I am simply posting this information to keep fellow shop owners up to date. If we don't help each other who will? I refuse to allow someone who wouldn't pay my normal everyday price to come back and sue me, take my hard work and flush it down the drain. Simply comes down to protecting yourself, your family, your interests. We have all worked way too hard for someone to come along and take it all away. Not every job is one you want to take.

 

Why do people buy furniture? Its marked up more than automotive parts are. Anyone had to buy popcorn at a movie theatre? What, you didn't bring your own and ask them to pop it for you? There's no difference. Everything we buy is marked up.

 

http://www.mangomoney.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/markups.jpg

[xrac]

............. In general I have not had good experiences with those who want to bring parts. I try, but they end up hosing me in the end....................

 

My experience is similar. People who bring there own parts tend to cost you a lot of extra time and aggravation. First, they misdiagnose the problem. Second, they have the wrong part because the counter people at the Autozone/Advance that they buy parts from on the weekend and evenings tend to be less than first rate and often supply the wrong part. Third, if you run into additional problems they don't want to pay for the additional work. Unless we are super slow I avoid customer supplied parts jobs.

[rjbradlow]

With me, again; Customer supplied parts are few and far between and I only make exceptions for customers I know under special circumstances.

(Nothing critical like in the fear mongering article above.) -- Again common sense dictates here.

If we must have a No BYOP policy, make it a No critical parts policy.

Brakes, steering, suspension, SRS, etc.

 

Typically with the ones who are looking for a good deal; I buy parts for less than they can and sell them right at or just below our favorite consumer store's prices and still turn a profit.

Joe blow off the street whom I've never met is another story. (Some training required)

Most end up returning their parts after a brief conversation where I sell the repair with my parts, others require wallet training.

The ones who refuse common sense logic are those special kind of stupid people I don't want as customers anyhow and these are the ones who may never learn anything.

 

And then there are those super 'Special' circumstances...

I have one customer I know very well from church and that his family is really struggling. Health / medical bills, etc...

When I first met him he was all about buying his own parts and I weened him off of the notion fairly quickly about 2 years ago.

Until recently; I know he's been out of work for a spell. He is starting a new job and we all know that when a family or person is living paycheck to paycheck things can get real ugly in a hurry.

So in this instance his AC has not worked for quite some time and his window switch just failed. -- rut row raggy

I searched for the lowest price which ended up being Rock Auto (No surprise) and had him order the switch directly then I installed it for free.

It's the little things that go a long way. "A loyal customer for life." - I hear this a lot.

 

I agree that many people who bring their own can be problematic. This is why I counsel them up front and sell them on the back side.

If we look at the numbers; How many BYOP customers do we see in a month or year? For me... Not many. But when I do, I win them over provided they are not bad apples.

Sometimes we have to compete with the consumer parts stores and it's really not that hard or bad for us to do. After all, Labor is 100%.

Even if it means only making a dollar on a part - So be it if we win a good customer in the process.

 

The numbers don't lie and I didn't build a customer base full of cheapskates... so I'm not 'helping myself out of business'.

As we all know; there are plenty of regular customers where a healthy markup is just fine and dandy and they are the majority.

 

And when one of our loyal customers falls on bad times...

Hey ... Fair is fair and it all washes out in the end.

You make a huge difference in their lives by being honest, flexible & fair.

They make a difference in yours when they rave about you to others.

 

...

Final thought:

As far as Phone Estimates go; ATS Automotive is spot on...

Next time they ask if they can get an estimate. Sure! When would you like to bring it in? Cut down on our estimate making, not ... sales.

 

Edited May 22, 2014 by rjbradlow