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Joe Marconi
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Gonzo Grand Master

Gonzo

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That was perfect Joe, I just finished an article for Brake and Frontend magazine that will probably be out in the next couple of months. I said basically the same thing. I'll post the story here for all to read...

 

Read it and see what you think. Here's my take on what "the general public" and the magazine think of reflashing. "Reflashing will be big business in the near future... we should all prepare to be able to do these. "

 

My only point, and I briefly went over it in the article is that I don't think "they" (the general public) understand that because of the Federal Clean Air Act we as the independent market only can program drivablility parameters. That's the law, and unless the manufacturer wants to be "nice" they don't have to tell us how to reprogram power seats or the like. I had to invest into dealer level scanners for the airbag and seats stuff for the GM's because I do so much for bodyshops and ... quite frankly bodyshops aren't fixing 8 to 10 year old cars... there all newer cars.

 

One more interesting point, a few years ago I did my first Ford reflash. I used the J2534 "mongoose" cable and software. I had all the proper information, the proper software on my laptop, the proper laptop, the correct info etc... etc... etc.. it still took me all day to walk myself thru the whole process... only to find out that all I can do is the drivability stuff... it happened to be a 4WD vehicle... sorry charlie... that ain't part of the independent drivability package. All I could do was get it started and make it shift the tranny... it still had to go to the dealer for another reprogram... which, I don't know why, they couldn't do it either... they couldn't enter the info over top of what I downloaded... they had to replace the PCM with a blank one.

 

The problem I see is that IF we do not get the right to repair act... THIS IS THE AREA WHERE WE ARE ALL GOING TO GET SCREWED IN !!!

 

Enough said about that.

 

 

To answer Gonzo's question. We don't do nearly enough reflashes at present time, but we are finding that the number is increasing. We probably do a few per month.

 

We primarily do Toyota's, GM and Fords. If you run a full service shop and want to compete with the dealer you will need to consider reflashing. We had a suburban the other day with a power seat problem that needed a reflash as the fix. If we did not have the equipment and GM subscription, we would have to send the car back to the dealer.

 

The money is made, however, when you promote reflashes, in other words; checking for vehicles that need updates as a routine service and looking for needed program updates when a car comes in with a driveablity, performance or emissions problem. It's like anything else, if you invest the time, education and money to equip your shop with the ability for reflash cars and you let the tool sit in your tool box, it will never pay for itself.

 

Hope this helped…

  • 3 months later...
blown3qtr Rookie

blown3qtr

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

The money is made, however, when you promote reflashes, in other words; checking for vehicles that need updates as a routine service and looking for needed program updates when a car comes in with a driveablity, performance or emissions problem. It’s like anything else, if you invest the time, education and money to equip your shop with the ability for reflash cars and you let the tool sit in your tool box, it will never pay for itself.

 

Hope this helped…

 

That's some great advice. I've been looking into relfashing capabilities for awhile now. There are not many independent shops in my area that do it. I had been looking into the drew technologies mongoose cables or dardaq, but ended up with a BWD Iflash because I got a good deal on it.

 

I plan on offering this service to some of the other shops in my area as well. I feel there is enough work out there for all of us and by workin together we can all make a living.

 

I have also bought rebuilt ECM's from other suppliers, not the NAPA store I primarily buy from because they could not offer a flashed pcm in a cost effective timely manner. I have tried to approach one of the NAPA salesmen as well as the store owner about working with them to flash replacement computers but somewhere the communication didn't quite go through. They just didn't seem to understand that I was trying to help them recapture the ECM/PCM sales they had lost in the past by offering that service to them (or other shops by way of recommendation). Anyway now that I have the hardware I will try my approach again.

Edited by blown3qtr
GeeZ Enthusiast

GeeZ

Posted
Posted

You are speaking of a STOCK reflash and not performance reflash, right? A performance flash, will probably void the engine warranty.

  • 1 month later...
scantoolnut Newbie

scantoolnut

Posted
Posted

The money is made, however, when you promote reflashes, in other words; checking for vehicles that need updates as a routine service and looking for needed program updates when a car comes in with a driveablity, performance or emissions problem. It’s like anything else, if you invest the time, education and money to equip your shop with the ability for reflash cars and you let the tool sit in your tool box, it will never pay for itself.

 

What's your set up?

 

For example, we have a dedicated lap-top for reflashing. By the time you fire the thing up, remember the software, and etcetera, there's no way it is worth the time and effort unless you are doing a Mercedes/BMW service. Those are the only customers that would pay you for a preemptive reflash anyway.

Gonzo Grand Master

Gonzo

Posted
Posted

The J2534 is the main reflash unit. Either with a mongoose cable or a J2534 box (tool) There are limitations. Some of those are that you only can flash transmission, engine, and security. (whatever fits the need to get it to start the car) You'll find all kinds of loopholes in the J2534, such as ... Chrysler... you have to have the part number off of the PCM (the part number is the "calibration" number.. (one in the same)) However you have to log onto Chrysler's site and check for the latest calibration update... (Checking the part number and any new revisions) These revisions are the last two digits of the part number (the suffix) If you don't have the latest software calibration downloaded into your PC and you try to download an old suffix calibration into the car... crash goes the computer... buy another PCM and start over, and if that happens you won't be able to install all the software, only the tranny, engine, and possibly the security, you'll still have to send it to the dealer. So make sure you have the latest at all times.

Ford has some similar issues, I do have a Mongoose cable (J2534) for Fords that plugs into my PC, but I also have the NGS and the IDS... The download on the Ford site is for J2534 applications ... nothing else is available for aftermarket.

I could go on about each site and the details... but it's pretty much the same thing... good, bad, and ugly...

 

Here's the one thing that NOBODY has mentioned in any of the classes I've attended, or lectures I've been to. YOUR PC HAS TO BE COMPATIBALE WITH THE MANUFACTURERS PROTOCALS. This IS the biggest pain in the ASS I deal with about getting onto the sites. One site will tell you that you have to have such and such pixel settings, with Java5, and then another has to have all of your security stuff (Norton etc...) off, and you have to have the start up reconfigured to allow certian popups while booting up. Some want all your screen savers off while others don't want any competitors software anywhere on your PC or it will corrupt each other to the point NOTHING works. Been there, done that.

 

I sometimes spend a day just getting the PC ready to accept the info to download from the manufacturer. AND, some of these issues require you to buy some special program to patch into your PC so the download will work... Example, you don't need to have Adobe 5 to get the 3 protocals and calibration files from Chrysler, however, if, ... a big if... you are instructed to view a TSB for the car you want to flash you got to have the Adobe 5... go find it.. yea, you'll shell out 1800 bucks to boot for it.

 

Look, I ain't the smartest socket jockey out there, I haven't a clue what have this crap is for when it comes to reflashing and why we have to do it... I think it's just the manufacturers way of making things more "self-protecting-of-their-own-products" I'm mean come on, do we really need to program a friggin drivers side window in a Mustang??? WTF is that all about. (yes I've had to do that to several) But I'm sure there's a whole bunch of techs out there that will tell me that they have a better way, well... damm it, quit hiding it A lot of this information I've learned the hard way and if there is more to the story then...tell the rest of ASO.. We are trying to work together here... If you have a better answer... and have experienced it... tell us... I'm all ears.

What's your set up?

 

For example, we have a dedicated lap-top for reflashing. By the time you fire the thing up, remember the software, and etcetera, there's no way it is worth the time and effort unless you are doing a Mercedes/BMW service. Those are the only customers that would pay you for a preemptive reflash anyway.

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      The Technician Shortage Is Our Fault, And It's Time We Own It
      Nearly every day, I hear shop owners complain: "There's a technician shortage. We can't find qualified people. There's no one out there." If that's true, then who's to blame?
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      Have We Pushed Technicians Away?
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      Many shop owners have learned that team morale, along with the opportunity to earn income, is important to technicians and to the company's long-term success. But let me ask you: how many technicians have left or been pushed out over the years because of the old flat-rate pay system?
      Another issue is the workplace environment. I remember being grateful to be hired as a young technician at a local repair shop. While very thankful, the work environment was not ideal. The shop owner kept the bay doors open year-round (I am from New York) unless it rained or snowed. He felt that if the bay doors were closed, customers might think we were closed for business. We had no heat and no hot water. Many of the jobs were done outside, year-round,  in all types of weather. The starting pay was minimum wage, with no benefits, sick days, or vacation pay. 
      Now, again, I need to point out that I was truly grateful for the opportunity this shop owner gave me. I learned a lot working there, and the experience was pivotal in my career. But looking back, I wonder how many people were discouraged by these working conditions?
      While the physical demands of the repair workplace are daunting, perhaps even more critical is the culture. Too many of my generation shop owners preached the mindset of "my way or the highway." We were the business owners, after all. We started our companies, took all the risks, and provided jobs. Why shouldn't we be the ones to set the ground rules our way?   
      Many of us found over the years that the "my way or the highway" mentality was a sure way to isolate employees and make them more likely to look over the fence for greener grass. In other words, it led many technicians to seek employment elsewhere, where they felt they could be appreciated and recognized for their hard work. The issue, however, was that there wasn't much green grass around. Disappointment after disappointment, bouncing from repair to repair shop, eventually led to despair. So, I ask you: were workplace conditions a contributing factor in today's technician shortage?
      Another factor that we are all well aware of is the complexity of the modern automobile. When I started, the work was mostly physical, and you were required to master essentially three vehicle models: General Motors, Ford, and Chrysler. Let's fast-forward to today. The evolution of automotive technology, along with the extensive training and tools required, has outpaced the typical technician's pay compensation, with no clear career path. Again, leading to frustration and insecurity about the future.
      Here is the bottom line: people don't leave their job; they leave their experience. We must do a better job. 
      The News Isn't all Bad; Your Next Steps to Fix the Technician Shortage
      To fix the technician shortage, it will take a combined effort from everyone in the automotive industry, particularly automotive shop owners. Shop owners are in the perfect position to make the greatest impact, not only on their businesses but also on the future automotive workforce.
      First, shop owners must become better leaders and understand that their ultimate success is directly dependent on the people they assemble around them. Any shop owner who mistakenly believes they can build an empire solely on their abilities is destined for serious disappointment. Business owners who think like this will eventually plateau. Without the collective contributions from a team of qualified people, your business will stall; it will not continue to grow.
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      Next, shop owners must become more financially knowledgeable. Knowing your numbers and what you need to achieve for a strong bottom-line profit is essential to paying technicians the money they need and deserve. Profit will also allow you to compete with other trade industries by providing a benefits package that has real take-home value and security.
      When it comes to culture, this is where the rubber hits the road. People crave recognition, praise, and a sense of purpose. Despite what you hear, people are not just money-motivated. Once people feel secure in their financial situation, retaining and motivating technicians can only be achieved by connecting with them on an emotional level. You cannot show enough appreciation. Give out praise for a job well done as if your business depended on it, because it does.
      As technicians age, we need to have a place for them. Expecting a 58-year-old to perform like a 35-year-old is unrealistic. We need to be more focused on career pathing. Provide training, skill development, and coaching to develop leaders and mentors within our older workforce. While their bodies may have slowed, the knowledge they have gained is priceless. 
      Our future is dependent on young people entering our industry. We need to give more young people opportunities. Every shop owner across the country should consider hiring an apprentice, then build an apprentice training plan and career path for them. If every shop did this, we could solve the technician shortage within five years. Get involved with the trade schools and high schools in your area. Look into the NAPA Apprenticeship Program. Don't sit on your hands with this one. Do it today.
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