tyrguy

20 hours ago, ncautoshop said:

Maybe so, there's only dealerships charging more so I hate to go up much more! While you guys are at $100+ our highest dealer is $85. We're currently at $75.00, and maybe I should go up but I don't want to price myself out of our market. 7 of 10 shops here are 45-55 an hour.

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For God's sake, raise your rates man. A lot, like 10 or 20 an hour. 3 things will happen.

#1 You'll lose some customers. Not necessarily a bad thing as the one's you lose will be the bottom feeders 

#2 Losing those customers means you'll have less of a backlog which will make the remaining customers happy. I'd love to be back to a week or two backlog.

#3 You're going to make a lot more money.

BTW, I haven't hired a tech in 23 years. He's still here as well as one I hired in 1983. Had one retire last year that was with me since 1979. I pay a base for 44 hours of $966 whether a customer walks in the door or not, or $35/ hour per billed hour whichever is higher. Also uniforms, 3 weeks paid vacation and 10k a year to offset their health insurance costs. The only problem on the horizon is that they will probably retire in the next 10 years.

10 hours ago, kars said:

When I worked for a large dealer chain, the bean counters claimed it cost about $350 to acquire a new customer. With that in mind $100 would be cheap, especially since it is not $100 in actual cost. On the other hand if you have wronged a good customer, it would be a sound business decision to spent up to $350 to keep a customer, if that's what it would take to make them happy, whole and keep them coming back.

If I could get 20 new customers a month for 2 grand I would do it in a heartbeat. I spend 1500-2000 a month in advertising with no guarantee of getting a single customer from it.

Right, not all cost, just cost AND PROFIT. At the end of the day, if you write a check for $100 and hand it to the customer [writing it off as advertising] or discount his bill $100 [thus decreasing sales] the result to your bottom line is the same. Your net is $100 less.

When you say you've grown 30+% I'm assuming you mean in sales and not car count, hours billed or some other metric. It's logical that you would have a big increase in sales if you raised your labor rate 42+%. So your car count and hours billed might not actually change, you're just making more for the same work. And that ain't a bad thing.

We don't prevent it, we allow it. I have never had an insurance company mention restricting customers in the bays in 38 years.

Anderson,

Likewise sorry to here about your month. We've been busy but we are just starting to notice the "back to school" slowdown.

I wasn't aware of the 7 year flat repair sales data. If true, coupled with the increase of bays in our town, I don't feel so bad about our downward trend. It would also explain why some shops in town have gone under.

Mark

Here's the thing. If this thread had started out with a statement such as "We all know that newer cars with longer service intervals and warranties, as well as car dealerships getting more aggressive with service has caused decreases in car counts to independent shops. But don't dismay, there are actions you can take to combat these forces and maintain the car counts you need to grow your business today and beyond", I would have never even posted a response. But instead the gist is basically to deny these facts and imply there is a quick fix.

But I understand why he didn't write it that way. Because of what he is selling, he would rather you believe there is no car count problem except in your shop [the cars are all in someone else's shop] and he has the "quick" fix.

52 minutes ago, Ron Ipach said:

tyrguy,

Please stop looking to blame outside forces for your car count numbers being off. This serves no one and almost seems like you've given up hope.

As I have pointed out several times to you before, if your numbers are off - it's up to YOU to fix it - and finding 'proof' there are fewer opportunities sure as heck isn't helping you fix it. Action will.

Hey Corporal Car Count first of all, don't tell me what to do. I've been in this industry for over 40 years and I believe I have a bit of insight to offer. I've seen industry highs and lows, new technologies come and go, competitors open and close up shop. I've made a ton of money and spent a ton of money. I'm still making a good living at this, just not near what I was 10+ years ago. But thankfully, I don't have to. I really don't have to do this anymore if I don't want to.

I know why MY car count is down. There are 2 reasons. First of all, IT'S A FACT THAT CARS REQUIRE LESS SERVICE THAN THEY DID 10+ YEARS AGO. Talk to any repair shop that has been in this business for at least 20 years and they'll tell you it ain't what it used to be. Secondly, in the last 10 years the amount of bays in my little town have double with 5 car dealerships opening up within a half mile of my shop.

Given up hope? Hell no!! I'm constantly evolving the way we do business. In the last 10 years we've built a beautiful new shop [opened 10 years ago this week], developed a great website, hooked up with a great CRM company to reach out and touch our customers constantly, and got involved with social media just to name a few of the things we've done. 

I agree that it's up to the shop owner to fix it. But it's also important not ignore forces out there that are causing the problems in the first place. 

On 7/28/2017 at 10:24 AM, AndersonAuto said:

I don't see the more reliable cars as a problem. There's no denying that cars are more reliable and require fewer visits to the shop, but there's also no denying that there are more cars on the road per shop than ever before, leaving each of us with more cars available even if those cars come to us less often per mile driven. There's also no denying that people in most areas of the country put more miles on their car every year. This leads to more wear and tear on the car, and more needed repairs.

You just have to go out and get them. My car count is up 11.75% on the year. This has been my trend for the last 5+ years. Probably more if I go back and look.

Actually total miles driven in this country peaked in June of 2005. https://www.advisorperspectives.com/dshort/updates/2017/06/20/vehicle-miles-traveled-another-look-at-our-evolving-behavior

"The Driving Boom – a six decade-long period of steady increases in per-capita driving in the United States – is over. 
Americans drive fewer total miles today than we did nine years ago, and fewer per person than we did at the end of Bill Clinton's first term. The unique combination of conditions that fueled the Driving Boom – from cheap gas prices to the rapid expansion of the workforce during the Baby Boom generation – no longer exists. Meanwhile, a new generation – the Millennials – sees a new American Dream that is less dependent on driving."

I didn't look up whether there are more cars on the road than ever because it really doesn't matter. What matters is that the total miles are down.

Less service due per mile x less miles driven = less overall repair opportunities

"tyrguy, I don't believe I've ever said the construction of newer cars has decreased the service needs of those cars."

That's exactly right!!!! Not only have you never said it, you won't even admit that it's a fact.

May I suggest again that  YOU CAREFULLY READ  POSTS BEFORE RESPONDING TO THEM.

And again as to your comment about solving the car count problem "quickly"....spoken like a true salesman.

You obviously don't read the posts you're responding to.

I do believe that there are ways to increase our car count and we are working on those everyday.

The problem I have with your comments is that:

#1 You can't admit that the construction of newer cars has decreased the service needs of those cars. Just say it "yes I believe that to be true, however...."

#2 This "problem" can be solved quickly.

"My point is this: Rather than accept the 'facts', find a way to fix the problem that ails you".

We accept those facts because we are out here everyday in the trenches and we know them to be true. And anyone who doesn't believe that the newer cars and the way they are built is contributing to decreased car count has their head in the sand. I have yet to meet a shop owner who does not believe that to be a fact.

However, just because we believe it to be true doesn't mean we're going to throw our hands up and give up trying to get better everyday.

The whole problem with this topic was when you posted "We all have these stories and shop owner excuses that we keep telling ourselves that we think are true, that when you really look at it, they're really utter bullshit, but we've been telling ourselves the same story over and over that we actually believe it's true."

Well I'm here to tell you it ain't bullshit.

Hide supplies charges by incorporating it into some other charges? Hell let's just hide everything. Supplies? Hide it. Parts? Hide it. Labor? Hide it. Sales tax? Hide it. Lets just have one big fat total at the bottom of the invoice. No itemization whatsoever. Yeh, that will go over big.

I read a lot of repair shop reviews and although I've seen reviews that say so and so shop has too high a labor rate or is marking their parts up too much, I've never seen a review that mentions supply charges at all.

We charge 5% of labor capped at $40.

"it's not a problem caused by cars being made better". 

Talk about BS. The changes in cars and their recommended service intervals is indeed a major cause of the decreased car count we are seeing. Take a car from 20+ years ago. Then, just consider 3 services LOFs, park plugs, coolant]  and their recommended intervals. Those older cars would have close to 40 intervals recommended during it's 1st 100k miles on just those 3 items. On today's cars it would be around 14. You can't look at those numbers and say that it doesn't make a difference.  Are there cars getting repaired in the shop down the road? Sure, just not as many. Most shop owners I know are no where near as busy as they were 10 years ago. And that's if they are still in business. Another friend who owned a shop in the town near me for 25+years just stopped in an last week and told me he closed his doors. As I've outline on this forum before, I've been in business for 38 years this Nov. For the 1st 30 years we were always busy. With 3 techs we would consistently bill 6050 hrs out of 6300 hrs [96%]. About 8 years ago we started to see a decline which continued thru 2015 when we billed 4600 out of 6300 hrs [73%]. In early 2016 my 1st employee from 1979 retired and I elected not to replace him. We are now back up to consistently billing 90+% of our hours with 2 techs. We have also raised our prices so that we are not too far off profit wise from where we were with 3 techs at 73%. And consider this. Since those "golden" years, we have a beautiful new shop, a great website, a CRM program thru mechanicnet. I could go on and on. We are definitely not sitting on past laurels. We are moving forward and using new tools to grow our business. But it's just not what it was 10+ years ago and the quality of the vehicles and the extended service intervals are a major part of the problem. 

It's a perfect example. As long as you put a tire that has at least the load rating of the OEM tire you're good to go. It doesn't matter how  much they overload the truck. But put a undersized tire on that doesn't meet the OEM load rating and you've created a big liability for yourself.

4 minutes ago, HarrytheCarGeek said:

I have a different experience from you that in court, waivers have worked for us, they are grown ups and they have to take responsibility for their actions. we always make sure they sign a work order, as it has notices, terms, and conditions under which we provide service.

Well it depends on what you're having them sign a waiver for. If the frame is rusting in two and you're working on the brakes you could have them sign a waiver that they know there is something unsafe about the vehicle apart from what you worked on. Or you could have them sign a waiver about a non safety item part that is failing but they are declining repairs. But when it comes to safety items, you are indeed the professional and you will be held responsible. Example: A customer brings tires in that have a lower load rating than is required for the vehicle and wants you to install them. Waiver or not, you will be held responsible if a tire fails due to overloading. And as I said before, the customer cannot sign a waiver protecting you from the liability of the other guy he hits.

Jay,

You do realize [or maybe you don't] that having those customers sign a waiver won't do you any good in court. The court will state that as the professional, you knew it was an unsafe situation and you will still be responsible. I always laugh when a customer says that they will sign a waiver relieving me of any liability. I then ask them if they can relieve me of the liability of the other person that they hit when they have an accident.

If your 1st service adviser has some tenure and you think he has some managerial skills, make him the "service manager" and have the new "service adviser" report to him. Let them figure out the work load. That's how it works in my shop. If that isn't that isn't the case you could split it up into two "teams" of 1 SA and 2 techs. 

IMHO, If you are selling a substantial amount of tires you should keep the numbers separate. Our mix is 55/45 service to tires in sales dollars. But our GP is 75/25 service to tires. Our GP in service is 78% vs 30% in tires. Remember though as I've stated on other threads, we state our GP the traditional accounting way which is sales minus the cost of the product, not including labor. No matter how you define GP though, you can see that including tire sales in your total GP calculation kills the numbers. Our total GP including both service and tires is 56%.

What we have seen is that someone with a high mileage trans that is already having issues will come in and request a fluid change to try to correct the problem. The service will be done and the trans will fail shortly thereafter. The service didn't kill it. It was already on it's way out.

We used to be at 30K on the trans fluids but felt that with many of the OEMs having no recommendations on that service we would increase it to 60K. We use 60K on the CVTs as well.

If you used a modern trans flush machine it will totally swap out the old fluid with new.

I don't believe that "90K leave it alone" theory. Maybe that was valid in the past [I personally don't believe it was] but on today's vehicles, a flush can never hurt. At least that's what the trans shop that sells us all our rebuilt units says.

Over the years we have developed some generic maintenance intervals to use on most vehicles. We have revised them as time goes by to reflect changes such as extending oil changes or extended coolant. Here's what we are presently recommending. Our POS system, Winworks Autoshop allows us to set up these intervals so that as a vehicle hits these mileages it automatically recommends them and when we do the service it automatically resets the recommendation in the future. Thoughts?

Oil changes:  semi syn  4K,  full syn  8K

Alignments: 12K

Tire rotations  5K

Brake flush  30K

Auto trans svce  60K

Man trans svce  60K

Coolant flush  60K   [older type coolant] 30K

Cabin air filters  30K

Fuel filter   30K

Fuel injection cleaning  30K

Spark plugs  copper 30K,  plat, irid 60K

Drive belts  80K

Coolant hoses  90K

Timing belts   90K

1 hour ago, Custom Coach said:

  Not to get off subject a little but I read on another thread where a man was told if he had a part for $ 100.00 his cost to tell the customer it was $ 200.00 and so on marking up the parts 100% how is this possible when people can go to these parts stores and get the exact same part and brand for a little more than what we are paying? 

 

You'll read that on a lot of the threads here that deal with parts pricing. Most of the successful guys on this forum are using a matrix that is set up to earn 50% GP [100% markup] average on their parts sales. Using our matrix a part that cost $100.00 would retail for $204.08.  We rarely get any push back on parts pricing.

We use the curly cue stretchable type plastic/nylon hoses that hang from the ceiling. They just reach the floor, are very light and last forever.

Read an article about fully autonomous vehicles yesterday. It basically says that for them to work, Lidar technology will be necessary. The current cost per unit is $75k. They say that the price of these will drop 90% to $7500 per unit. However the vehicle manufacturers need the price to be at $100 per unit. That's a ways off. Other articles have stated that for fully autonomous vehicle to work, ALL vehicles need to be full autonomous so they are all talking to each other. Now, semi autonomous vehicles for freeway driving is probably doable in the near future. Fully autonomous no steering wheel and pedals, not so much. BTW, on the bright side, I'll bet you the more autonomous they become, the more they will build safety features into the system that won't let a poorly maintained vehicle operate. Your vehicle will tell you brakes are needed and at some point, it won't operate until those are fixed.

One of my all time favorites was when we did an alignment and the customer came back the next day complaining that her radio didn't work any more. Well, she had it turned up so loud my tech had turned it off. That's what the problem was but she had never turned it off before and didn't know how to turn it back on.