AutoShopOwner - Automotive Management Network: Should there be a standard Diagnostic charge - AutoShopOwner - Automotive Management Network

Joe Marconi, on 27 January 2010 - 09:46 AM, said:

So just like the chain stores that will scan your car for free, your willing to do that... ok, that's fine... I'm a small shop and when I spend a couple of grand on a "code reader" and after reading the code... the customer then says... "Oh, that's going to be to expensive to fix.... no thanks, I'll wait..." where's that leave me....
""" FOR SALE ---- ONE SLIGHTLY USED SCANNER --- """"
I know I can't agree with what your saying... hey, if it works... good for you... But it sounds to me as if it's the customer that has to be educated that these tests do cost money.... and nothing in this world is free.... I'm sorry, I just don't agree with your theroy... I can't think of a time I went to the doctor... and he said "Oh, it's just the common cold, since was so simple for me to figure it out... I'm not going to charge you as much.,,," Yea, right... that'll happen...

I think it would have to do with who the customer is. Mr. Powers has 5 vehicles that I service. He comes to me with a check engine light on, I will read it for free because he has spent thousands of dollars with me and will be back and he will send customers my way. Mrs. Jones who was referred to me by her friend at the beauty shop and her check engine light is on and I have never seen her vehicle before, I will quote a diagnostic fee.

Ok, I hear you all. I knew this would make heads spin. I don't think I am getting my point across.

I am not suggesting we give anything away, I am suggesting that we change our approach. I treat all customers as if they just spent thousands. Why? Because if I create a customer, that customer will be worth thousands to me in time.

We are a high volume shop (200plus car per week). I get a lot of new customers each day. My sales have up because I learned that in order to keep my bays full I need to see what the customer sees. Their perception is the only reality that matters.

Just think of this: I rather spend the time with the customer selling the DIAG work than trying to defend my charges before I even looked at the car.

That's it...Simple. I have not given anything away...I have in fact increased my DIAG sales with happier customers.

CARMandP, on 27 January 2010 - 10:10 AM, said:

CarMan.... You got it... that's my approach... I'm not a high traffic shop, never intended to be... but I would like to think professional courtesy is important... and that professionalism goes both ways.... Mr. Powers in one direction, because he keeps the bays full... Mrs. Jones... I would like to think that as a customer you should never expect something for free... I like the way you stated this issue.... congrats!!

Joe,

What do you do with the customer that says "I just want to know what the code is" or "I just want the light cleared for now"? Is that done at no charge also?

I'm just trying to see all the pro's and con's on this approach, not trying to stir the pot. I REALLY like the approach, and I can see myself doing this, and my reasoning is, there are a lot of places that are offering free scans, and I think it is just to get them in the door. Its a nice approach to keeping up with the competition and not joining them.

Joe Marconi, on 25 January 2010 - 12:58 PM, said:

We tried the "free diagnoistics" and couldn't make it profitable. Most of the free diagnoistic stuff (think Auto Zone) results in selling people things they don't actually need and we have problems with that. I have also saw the places who offer free diagnostics some very large estimates and we have problems selling more repairs then people may actually need. Thus we have comromised by doing a discounted diagnostic which is about 50% of what we should charge but it is our compromise solution. It keeps people coming in the doors and we recoup some of our costs.

Let me try again to express myself. I am not suggested we offer a free diagnosis. Nor do I want to follow the path of AAMCO by advertising “We’ll check it for Free”. Nothing is for free, we all know that. My entire business model is predicated on honesty and integrity, not bait and switch.

Consider this: How many times has a customer (old or new) come to you with a check engine light and before you rolled the car in the bay you went through an entire presentation on the complexity of the system and all the charges associated with the analysis only to find that the gas cap was loose?

Or, what about a customer that is on her way to work and the check engine light comes on, but really can’t leave the car. Tell me none of you ever scanned the car just to give her peace of mind?

Here is the concept: Explain to the customer that until we access the error codes, we do not have a direction on what tests we need to perform. Offer to the customer the initial scan with the understanding that after that scan is done, we will explain the necessary steps needed to complete the actual diagnosis. We tell them that this scan is not in any way a diagnosis. We actually give them a price range before hand.

I know that there will be those times that the customer will say, thanks for the info and goodbye. But we take that chance every time we try to sell anything.

I feel that this approach helps to comfort the customer. My analysis charges are more than the local dealers in my area. They come to me and pay more because of the value and service we offer.

Joe Marconi, on 27 January 2010 - 03:02 PM, said:

You know, I feel this discussion is really making a difference, Joe, thanks for letting me post my article on the subject. It's really got people tallking... and I think, that, is, the best thing that could ever happen.

Now, my take... which by the way... is my version... of course we all have our opinions... but hey, that's what this is all about.
My take on all this.... a Joe, your baiting them... oh come on Joe... you know thats just a polite way to put it.... you're baiting them and hoping they come in for the repair. Your not calling it that, your being as thoughtful to the customer as you can be.... and I think it would be affective... but lets play with this a little... Here's another scenario that needs to be considered. Let's say you have a regular customer that you see every other week with a lot of cars, maybe even a fleet. He is out of town and can't get back to your shop. He goes to a unfamiliar shop... they look at his vehicle and they charge him a diagnostic fee straight up front.... I can just see the guy going balistic... because... he is not use to the charge... and thinks this guy must be ripping him off.. .... well, now what. Oh, he is a loyal customer of yours and he comes back and tells you all about the rip-off artist he was at.
But, lets look at it this way..... if (IF) there was a standard policy on diagnostics that was across the board ... would there be that much to bitch about... if everyone in the independent market charged... "something" for the diagnostics and didn't hide it in the cost of the repair ... maybe.. just maybe people would then consider it normal business practice. And not be so quick to call us all crooks for doing our jobs.

Keep this going ... I'd like to hear every angle on this subject... everyone has a thought about it... come on... tell us... I'd like to know, and so would the rest .. I'm sure of that.

Yes this is a very stimulating topic. This is what this forum is all about; the free exchange of ideas and opinions. Thank you for initiating it.

Now back to the topic. It most certainly is not baiting. I would not resort to that. If you knew me better you would never suggest that.

Maybe, I’m not explaining myself correctly. We explain all the expected charges up front. We never, never, Never, NEVER say we offer a free diagnosis or free analysis. We don’t market it that way or advertise it that way. And with regular customers, the issue never comes up.

Now, let me try to re-visit this again: A customer arrives at the front counter and says: “My check engine light is on, how much to fix it.” Our upfront policy WAS to tell the customer the analysis charges and sell it. We then explained that after the analysis, we would discuss the repair.

The problem with this is that some customers see no value in this because we really do not know what is happening with the car before we do some sort of scan. There is also a fear about the total cost of the job (analysis plus repair). Plus my advisors were spending too much time educating the customers. Most of time they did go for the analysis, but I can tell that some customers had some issues.

So we came up with this strategy. If we feel that there is an issue, we offer the customer a complimentary scan to get a direction where we need to go. We fully explain that depending on what we see with the scan you will be looking at “X” amount for the analysis fee. And after the analysis is done, we will discuss the repair. We have an easier time with this stadegy and the customer feels like we are looking out for his best interest.

We try to see this from the customer’s point of view.

As for you scenario of my customer out of town; this industry is so all over the map, I can be worried about what may happen in that case. We get challenged on procedure every day, because there are no standards.

You propose standards, that’s all well and good, but that will take some doing to accomplish, if it is even possible.

Does this make better sense?

Joe Marconi, on 27 January 2010 - 06:45 PM, said:

Makes perfect sense Joe, and YES I totally.... TOTALLY... believe there should be standards... and yes... it would very hard to ever think it would be standard across the board... But, hey, we can dream.... right now it's close to a nightmare... LOL... just kidding... But I see your point. and I hope the rest of our readers get involved and put theri comments out there... the more input we can have the more likely we may acutally solve these issues... It's not me, it's not you... its US... that will make the difference in the future of this business. ... I hope I'm making sense...

We need this dialogue to come together as an industry. As a veteran with more than 35 years in this business I have nothing but the upmost respect for shop owners. These are the people that keep this country moving. We work hard and we sacrifice for the public, sometime, with little to show for it.

It may be a dream, but its worthwhile chasing that dream.

Great topic, what else is on your mind????????

Here is more fuel for this fire. TB Service Zone Newsletter

In this article the writer points out that all some shops do is clear codes and send people on their way. How many times has a customer come into your shop with a service engine soon light on who says that it has been on for months or years and "their" mechanic says it wasn't anything. Between the discount parts stores with their code readers and technicians/mechanics who don't understand diagnosis and the way cars operate today we face an up hill battle.

xrac, on 07 February 2010 - 12:41 PM, said:

This is a problem we encounter in our area too.

Just yesterday I had someone come to us asking to reset the check engine light so he can pass the NY State Inspection. When I explained to him why I could not, he told me that he has been doing this for years!! He then went on to tell me that he was new to the area and first went to the Valvoline Quick Lube down the block from me and they told him that they don’t work on check engine lights.

I explained to him that we would need to diagnose the problem before he could pass the state’s inspection test. He looked at me with a smirk and walked out in a huff.

If other shops are resetting check engine lights out there, they need to stop.

Sometimes, we are our own worst enemy.

The "technicians" and "shops" that tell customers to ignore check engine lights that they don't mean anything are really doing the customer and the industry a diservice. There are evidently some thatr do this because I still hear it from time to time. Probably more of a carry over thinking from the OBD1 days.

xrac, on 07 February 2010 - 07:51 PM, said:

I think we need a code of ethics that all shops adhere to. It must be confusing for the public too. You have one shop that resets the light and sends them on their way, while another shop wants to properly diagnose it. It would be nice if we were united, but maybe I just a dreamer.

Joe Marconi, on 07 February 2010 - 02:48 PM, said:

An across the board standard... yes... I'm for that.... if everyone is one the same page... then it's not so hard for the customer to feel more confident.. then it's just "who" the consumer wants to do the work... not so much the price..

In my book there is a chapter on this subject... page 168... it's not the perfect solution.. but just like the diagnostic article... it's an idea, an opinion... it's thoughts on paper... something for all us to think about. Gonzo

The problem with our industry is the lack of consistently from shop to shop. We continue to portray a low image of the auto service business. Just look at the condition a lot shops are and the overall look of the customer reception area. Not to mention the bathrooms in too many shops.

If we are to move from the Stone Age we need to clean up our act across the board. No code of ethics will work if we don’t send the right message to the consumer.

Joe Marconi, on 08 February 2010 - 08:37 AM, said:

That's a great name for it Joe.... Code of Ethics... I like that... In fact I'm talking with "Brake and Front end Magazine" I might have the "Diagnostic fee Diagnostic free" story reprinted in their magazine. We should get a lot of repsonce. If possible I may even mention this website.

So what would you put in a code of Ethics list? I would love to have one that is pretty universal (agreed upon) that I could post on the wall in my shop.

Gonzo, on 08 February 2010 - 02:57 PM, said:

I would appreciate any mention you could make. I feel that AutoShopOwner can provide a great, needed service to our industry,

Thanks,
Joe